The FBI Files: Dents Run Civil War Gold
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Tom_in_CA
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This is the theory that he knows there's no treasure, and knows that all this is bologna, yet "lies" nonetheless. That may be.
But the other alternative is that he is JUST THIS SINCERELY DELUDED. And can spin things in such a way to allow those otherwise-damning-factoids to somehow be spun in the affirmative.
Like this video I made. In this video, notice that patient is only ever always "sincere" and "authentic", during his entire belief delusion :
Someone probably told them if you ever want experts to come look at one of your sites it isn't a good idea to have public posts of yourself trashing the opinions of the last experts you dealt with.
Nothing these guys do make themselves look even a little bit professional.
Nothing these guys do make themselves look even a little bit professional.
Carl-NC
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Tom_in_CA
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Carl, you are a breath of fresh air, regarding the dowsing part of this Dents Run saga.
And I will say it again : Although you haven't been able to get through to any of the hard-core dowsing proponents, to change minds (as far as I know ?), yet rest assured : There are lots of fence sitters, that have read your material (since you've trafficked in that debate for years), that ARE INDEED benefited , persuaded, etc...
So even though these fellows you challenged years ago didn't necessarily change sides of the aisle, yet : Your work was not in vain. There are plenty of sideline fence-sitter readers, that woke up and took notice, use your lines-of-reasoning, etc...
Thus : You are a breath of fresh air. I can't imagine it will do guys like Dennis (the hardcore variety) any good. Their philosophical presupposition is simply planted too deep.
I walked that site with prada years ago, no evidence of it being native at all. Geological formation similar to the rest of the sand stone in pa. Only evidence of man was the stone cutting from it used in 1800s to build a chimney just down the hill from this site.
Tom_in_CA
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And you have to wonder what does pre-history native American sites have to do with supposed "fabulous treasure" anyhow ?
Probably because the moment you say anything about "Indians" to couch-potato laymen, they have immediate mental connotations of some wild wild west movie. To conjure up and justify any treasure you can think of, eh ? I mean, shucks, the minute you add "Native Americans" to the narrative, then.... by golly ..... IT MUST BE TRUE, eh ?
GoDeep
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These are just my own personal observations: I've seen no evidence that Plaintiff is Mentally Ill, Crazy or Sincerely Deluded. What I have seen in the evidence record is a concerted effort by Plaintiff to time again misrepresent evidence, fabricate evidence, lie about the evidence and even delete the evidence when it is incriminating. This coupled with his constant drumbeat of trying to obtain a TV show leads me to believe his behavior is calculated in an attempt to secure said TV show.
Further corroboration is his pivot to the new sites where the exact same modus operandi of Dents Run is emerging and his ever present and explicitly stated desire to obtain a TV Show. Another great point ucnegold brought to my attention is that Plaintiffs position is essentially, "No TV show-no dig", even explicitly stating so in a recent post.
Further corroboration is his pivot to the new sites where the exact same modus operandi of Dents Run is emerging and his ever present and explicitly stated desire to obtain a TV Show. Another great point ucnegold brought to my attention is that Plaintiffs position is essentially, "No TV show-no dig", even explicitly stating so in a recent post.
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Tom_in_CA
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And I know we have gone over this before, but I think Plaintiff is sincere. Because when someone *starts* with a philosophical presupposition, then all-of-reality (the evidence, etc....) is shaped and filtered through the lens of their philosophical presupposition. Just as my DMDB video shows. So too do I think Plaintiff can sincerely think there is or was a fabulous treasure there (and all the others elsewhere he keeps yapping about).
Just at the patient in my video was, uh... ."quite sincere" :
GoDeep
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I don't doubt that some treasure hunters fall into this category but the evidence doesn't support it with Plaintiff. He may have at one time thought he found treasure, but he has long since fallen from anything even remotely resembling somebody who "sincerely believes".
- You've described Plaintiff on several occasions as "sincere" or in a state of "sincere belief". There is nothing even the least bit "sincere" about Plaintiff's actions and words. The evidence shows that Plaintiff is incredibly "insincere" and will lie about, fabricate, misrepresent and delete any evidence.
- It is not just evidence, he will also not hesitate to lie about anything associated with or peripheral to the dig including court cases, lawyers, Tv shows, Senate, saving the site from logging, dates/times and will even violate the law as well as make unfounded accusations about anyone.
None of Plaintiff actions or words the past 6 years are those of someone who "sincerely believes".
sin·cere
adjective
- free from pretense or deceit; proceeding from genuine feelings:
- (of a person) saying what they genuinely feel or believe; not dishonest or hypocritical:
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GoDeep
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The video is also a fallacy of relevancy in the instant case for several reasons:
1. The subject in the video is not fabricating evidence or using deception to convince others of his belief as Plaintiff is.
2. Plaintiff is not a patient in a psych ward.
3. Video subjects "sincere belief" arises out of mental illness.
4. No one has provided any evidence that Plaintiff suffers from any mental illness and until such time someone proves that he is, we can only conclude that he is completely cognizant of his actions.
1. The subject in the video is not fabricating evidence or using deception to convince others of his belief as Plaintiff is.
2. Plaintiff is not a patient in a psych ward.
3. Video subjects "sincere belief" arises out of mental illness.
4. No one has provided any evidence that Plaintiff suffers from any mental illness and until such time someone proves that he is, we can only conclude that he is completely cognizant of his actions.
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I have mentioned it before in this thread. I met him once at this site not long after he first mentioned this supposed native site on another forum. He showed me round stacked field stone claiming they were native American graves. He then took me to the sand stone outcrop. He thinks it was a "vortex" and worshiped by the natives. He also thinks the stones were stacked in structures because there are a bunch of large rectangular rocks. Most of them are very uneven blocks that look like it happened in natural fractures. Some were left over from 1800s farms nearby, and a couple hundred yards down the hill there is a old chimney made from the same stone (which he claims is the site of a kgb stash in an underground cave but thats another story). One of the truck size sandstone boulders is vaguely shaped like an arrow head which he also states as evidence. A huge natural crack in the sandstone was a "carved hallway". And it keeps going and going. He lets his imagination run wild in a machinegun fire type of way. It literally kept jumping from one thing to another with no correlation or use of reason. Geology and the history of the area was ignored. With some simple google searching i was able to find out everything from how the glaciers carved that area and the stones it dropped off, to the accounts of the first settlers of that specific piece of land and how they cursed the leader for settling in an area with all those stones. It made their life tough and made it very hard to farm( those stacked field stones were graves though!). The origional settlers even said it was as if a god spilled an apron full of rocks across the land. But evidence like this they didn't even look for or consider. It just had to be some fantastic story to rewrite history in their minds. I tried to kinda insert some opinions of mine to explain things but it was ignored. An example of this was pointing out that "carved hallway" had matching sides almost as if you could stick it back together from where it broke and moved down the hill, minus some weathering of course. But they just jumped on to the next thing. It was honestly tiring trying to listen to it all. There was much more that went on but very little had much worth looking into. From what i could figure in the end that site came down to glaciers and 1800s stone cutting and stacking for the settlers in the nearby area.
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I feel he is like so many con men and hucksters just trying to cash in on others gullibility! Buyer Beware!!
GoDeep
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Agreed! Don't get me wrong, I do believe he started out some 30+ years ago truly believing he may have found the location of some buried treasure at Dents Run, however, that initial innocence is long gone. The evidence overwhelming supports that he is very calculated in his con to get a TV show and the truth will not get in the way.
Does he still believe there was gold there? Maybe, but it's irrelevant at this point as he's committed to falsifying a narrative to obtain fame or a show. Full Stop!
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parada knows he is lying about everything and DOESN’T beleive he ever found gold.
Dents run is no different than his Templar graves and vaults he said he found in Nova Scotia. Once he realized no one bought into his con he moved on and never looked back.
Dents run is no different than his Templar graves and vaults he said he found in Nova Scotia. Once he realized no one bought into his con he moved on and never looked back.
GoDeep
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I don't know if I agree that he believes he never found gold (or at least spots where he thought gold may be).
What's telling is his most recent pivot to the Round Island Falls site and we are seeing the exact same MO as Dents Run and are already catching him making up lies about it, attacking experts and deleting posts. Thats not someone who's sincere about this endeavor and he's definitely not in search of the actual truth.
Carl-NC
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All of what you say is indicative of delusional thinking. I've been around a number of guys who think the same way, and they honestly believe everything they say, at least consciously. When the facts cannot be ignored or dismissed any longer, the story changes to something else, like KGB or Native Americans. If you want a long-running example of this, go to TNet and visit the Treasure Marks/Signs forum, particularly the thread "A Guide to Vault Treasure Hunting." You'll read the exact same stuff, been going strong for 8 years now.
