Tom_in_CA
Elite Member
- Joined
- Dec 23, 2013
- Messages
- 20,772
I only have one thing to say about this link: That stripper is cuter than scuba-detective. Sorry scuba !
A New Police Encounter for Me!
- Thread starter ScubaDetective
- Start date
I only have one thing to say about this link: That stripper is cuter than scuba-detective. Sorry scuba !
Troque-master, your notions of "why swat hornet's nests" was EXACTLY my first reaction to Scuba's encounters. Eg.: There's "bigger fish to fry" . And "why draw attention to ourselves ?" And "better to give lip service" (and simply come back later, blah blah). And to the average person, you and I are probably right : This notion of "give me a ticket" and defy and resist, is, yes, *normally* fool-hearty. And I would be the first to agree that this will surely mean that laws will be written to "address our pressing issue", blah blah.
Ie.: As much as I love to muse the legal aspects of our hobby (and "just do it" mentality), yet : I'm also the first to advise to give lip service and move on. Ie.: I'm not one of those types to demand my "constitutional rights" and "give me a ticket" and "fight it in court" , etc..... Because, even though I don't think (like scuba) that I'm doing anything wrong, yet : There's better hills to die on. And I'm not going to "convert every last person on earth" to agree with me.
So with that said, yes, Scuba and I had some .... uh .... debates on this years ago. But I've come to conclude that Scuba is a rare exception to this. So as much as I wouldn't recommend his "defy" stance to the "average Joe", yet for some reason (his "calm/cool/collect" ?), he's seemed to defy the odds.
Thus at first blush, yes, I can see where you're coming from. I too tried to take him to task . Suggesting the folly of his stance. But there is the rare type individual who can navigate this jungle. So he is the rare individual to which this "just give lip service and come back later" admonition doesn't seem to apply.
Agreed, Tom and I go way way back. He knows a lot that has happened to me and he hasn't resorted to judging me by calling names or wanting to get into my personal life. He respects me and I respect him. He might disagree with my antics but he is NOT me and we show each other respect. He has suggested a different approach BUT so far I have yet to try it. THAT is entirely my choice.
I don't judge folks that get told by an officer to leave and they do without question. In the one instance where I received three citations at one time another detecorist who was wading did what he was told, he left. NOT ME. There are reasons for my actions but I don't need to explain them on here for ridicule. BUT it boils down to I was right and the officer was wrong and the judge dismissed all the charges with the officer there. I REFUSE to find a nice detecting spot over an hour away from my house, just to have a police officer with nothing better to do on his agenda than to harass someone that is NOT doing anything illegal. It is THAT simple. You folks can all do what you desire and so can I. They will NOT change the law because someone stood up for his rights. Enough said. I will respect what others do but don't expect me to bow down to overzealous officers or homeowners or anyone when I am just out in the water minding my own business and not bothering anyone at all.
I will keep my truck, I will enjoy helping others getting what they loose in the lakes and rivers back and I will also enjoy the fruits of this hobby.
Last edited:
GKL
Forum Supporter
......and also many many members know that Robert is a person of integrity, and those of you have read some of his posts over time will see how he has helped people. Typed communication can sometimes be easily misunderstood as to the attitude behind it, so people need to be careful not to be too quick to assume and judge someone in a negative way simply based on a forum thread.
We all can disagree on various points now and then, but we need to be careful not to turn it into a personal attack against the persons themselves, this is called the "Friendly" metal detecting forum for a reason
davidlhyde63366
Forum Supporter
......and also many many members know that Robert is a person of integrity, and those of you have read some of his posts over time will see how he has helped people. Typed communication can sometimes be easily misunderstood as to the attitude behind it, so people need to be careful not to be too quick to assume and judge someone in a negative way simply based on a forum thread.
We all can disagree on various points now and then, but we need to be careful not to turn it into a personal attack against the persons themselves, this is called the "Friendly" metal detecting forum for a reason
Good you reminded the members this the Friendly Metal detecting forum. Hope they will keep it that way. Love seeing Robert's post of his under water finds both on here and on Facebook .
FreeBirdTim
Elite Member
Fair enough. I've had a few people harass me over my views on guns and hunting, so I know how petty and childish some posters can be here.
Tom_in_CA
Elite Member
- Joined
- Dec 23, 2013
- Messages
- 20,772
Note, it's these type sentences which understandably give any new forum reader "the willies". So it's easy to see why some people can take exception with posts like this. This is NOT advice that Robert is giving to the rest of us. The average Joe will indeed get plowed under with "the system". Therefore, yes, when it comes to rank-&-file "scram" issues (with md'ing), sometimes you just give lip service. And avoid that singular lookie-lou going forward (rather than "trying to convert him").
Also bear in mind, that most of these brushes had to do with diving legalities (or something silly like his truck this time). Not md'ing legalities.
So: If you're an expert in a given field, and have a background in LEO, and are calm/cool/collect, fine. But for anyone else, No. You ..... "don't try this at home", haha
Soil Surgeon
Forum Supporter
This is the way of the internet , If a guy said that he helps little old ladies cross the street there would be someone who would claim he is luring them away to assault them . Some folks just thrive on stirring the pot .
Soil Surgeon
Forum Supporter
......and also many many members know that Robert is a person of integrity, and those of you have read some of his posts over time will see how he has helped people. Typed communication can sometimes be easily misunderstood as to the attitude behind it, so people need to be careful not to be too quick to assume and judge someone in a negative way simply based on a forum thread.
We all can disagree on various points now and then, but we need to be careful not to turn it into a personal attack against the persons themselves, this is called the "Friendly" metal detecting forum for a reason
Agreed !
Soil Surgeon
Forum Supporter
GLASSHOPPER1955
Elite Member
Hey, Scube, just wanna say "Good on ya" and that's a darn nice truck there. 
Rock Jock
Elite Member
ScubaDetective, do you have any experience-based information you can share (NOT to be construed as legal advice!) regarding where local police authority ends (above mean high high tide?) and open beach intertidal (below seasonal high swash line to the water's edge?) and shallow submarine (although not necessarily swimming, but wading). I've had an encounter with a National Park Ranger claiming that I can't MD inside an area he indicated, some of which was clearly intertidal beach including wet water, that was "National Park". I didn't push the issue but I thought there was a fair chance he was all wet in the intertidal realm. Clearly, local and/or land-based federal agency police authority has to end somewhere along the marine coastline and state and federal coastal authority take over(different rules). It becomes confusing along coastal areas.
Sorry I do not know the laws in South Carolina. EVERY state and jurisdiction THINKS they can make laws to control the waterway. In Michigan, If a lake has ANY public access, owners of property around the lake ONLY have a deed to the high water mark. If a lake is privately owned all the way around it and an owner gives you permission to hunt his property you can legally hunt a pie shaped piece of property all the way out to the middle. BUT the minute you SET FOOT on the bottom land of his neighbors you are trespassing. You can however boat, and swim around the whole lake. You can even anchor anywhere on the lake. BUT you physically cannot touch the bottom.
Now here is the kicker. If you DO touch the bottom and trespass, the owner has to see you touch. Then the owner has to advise you not to trespass. THEN if you trespass again he can file a police report and have you cited. For a wader that would be easy, For a diver, a lot harder.
Detroit has an ordinance stating you cannot swim or dive in the Detroit river in city limits unless in a roped off swimming area. How Detroit legislatures think they can govern a federal international waterway is a good question. HOWEVER in that same ordinance is a provision for bona fide underwater commercial diving operation.
EVERY jurisdiction has their own ideas of what laws they want to make and enforce. I can only help folks in Michigan. Sorry
Rock Jock
Elite Member
Thanks for relating the experiences, ScubaDetective. This is exactly the kind of thing I was looking for. I think a lot of sub-federal jurisdictions just hang these sundry encroachments out there and see who salutes. Estuarine environments with a marine channel wedge might be another gray area in South Carolina. It seems that you can't readily use an airboat in SC. Other states? No problem. It seems like there are lots of inconsistencies in the relationships between the states and the feds. I wouldn't be surprised to discover that others on the forum may have relevant experiences they could share.
TorqueMaster
Elite Member
Troque-master, your notions of "why swat hornet's nests" was EXACTLY my first reaction to Scuba's encounters. Eg.: There's "bigger fish to fry" . And "why draw attention to ourselves ?" And "better to give lip service" (and simply come back later, blah blah). And to the average person, you and I are probably right : This notion of "give me a ticket" and defy and resist, is, yes, *normally* fool-hearty. And I would be the first to agree that this will surely mean that laws will be written to "address our pressing issue", blah blah.
Ie.: As much as I love to muse the legal aspects of our hobby (and "just do it" mentality), yet : I'm also the first to advise to give lip service and move on. Ie.: I'm not one of those types to demand my "constitutional rights" and "give me a ticket" and "fight it in court" , etc..... Because, even though I don't think (like scuba) that I'm doing anything wrong, yet : There's better hills to die on. And I'm not going to "convert every last person on earth" to agree with me.
So with that said, yes, Scuba and I had some .... uh .... debates on this years ago. But I've come to conclude that Scuba is a rare exception to this. So as much as I wouldn't recommend his "defy" stance to the "average Joe", yet for some reason (his "calm/cool/collect" ?), he's seemed to defy the odds.
Thus at first blush, yes, I can see where you're coming from. I too tried to take him to task . Suggesting the folly of his stance. But there is the rare type individual who can navigate this jungle. So he is the rare individual to which this "just give lip service and come back later" admonition doesn't seem to apply.
Truthfully Tom, I have no quarrel with him standing his ground with LEOs, even if it gets him a citation that will be thrown out. Being he's an ex-LEO, he's on a more even footing to do so. Clearly he knows the law and stands up for himself. That's all fine, some officers might get educated at least.
My view of him -- based narrowly on the two posts in this thread -- is he's not someone I'd want to associate with. He may be a swell guy and well liked, and he's got number to prove it, so I'm quite impressed.
The car thing -- obviously it looks like a cop car, maybe he was being facetious when he said it didn't. There will surely be times, as someone else mentioned, that cars may stack up behind him on the highway, no one daring to pass. I object to anyone unofficial who consciously, ignorantly, or deliberately hampers the free flow of traffic. It's in the same vein as cars that sit in the passing lane, but not passing anyone, or the truck doing 65.5 passing the truck doing 65. We all probably know the highway driving public has no clue about actual safe vehicle spacing -- in my opinion, being lined up behind an "official" vehicle is less safe than letting the traffic flow freely...and danged annoying.
It appears he's had many more run-ins with LEOs than most of us. He must be doing something to cause that. It's his choice to continue those behaviors. I suspect he enjoys the conversation/debate/conflict, being right, ultimately winning, and bragging about it. I also consider those LEOs dealing with him would be better serving the community using their time looking for impaired/ distracted drivers or whatever they normally do. I'm more neutral on this situation -- if his activities are "important", and there's no suitable substitute that won't generate a visit from the law, keep on keeping on. If there are substitutes, do them instead, avoid potentially wasting LEOs time. Aren't they perpetually short on manpower?
Anyway, I'm not a fan. I'll let others who are better debaters and enjoy the debate butt heads with him if they want. I state the facts I see, and my opinions, and hope they have some impact. They usually don't, especially not with certain personality types. I've come to accept that.
Ok, now I'm really moving on to other threads where *MY* posts are hopefully more hobby related. peacelovecrabs
IF folks really believe my truck is a police vehicle it is their problem and not mine. It is an advertising gimic and it is working beautiful.
I WIN as you call it because I am RIGHT. NO RICH homeowner who FEELS he owns a lake is going to shove me around PERIOD. How am I wasting LEO's time? I didn't call them. They were called by RICH SNOBS 99% of the time. Most the time the homeowners get educated and the officers leave. BUT there have been exceptions and I will NOT bow down to an officer or a rich homeowner if I am right PERIOD. I have a LOT of stories, even one where the homeowner went to jail. I was a state cop when that happened.
ALL my threads are hobby related. My truck is hobby related. The ONLY thing I am doing to have a homeowner call the police is metal detect a lake. I will ALWAYS stick up for my rights and the folks that don't like it or agree with me, THAT is your problem not mine. And I can brag about it if I desire. Too many officers feel they can push anyone around because they have a badge and a gun. Well I used to.
You are not a fan, big deal, I can't please everyone. BUT to sit behind your PC and judge others is not the way to make any friends. You don't like my truck, your problem. You don't like the way I handle myself. your problem. The so called FACTS as you see them, is also your problem. Since I am not breaking any laws, your supposed scenario's are also your problem. I won't bow down to a cop in person, I sure won't bow down to an arm chair metal detectorist that tries to judge me.
Tom_in_CA
Elite Member
- Joined
- Dec 23, 2013
- Messages
- 20,772
Scuba, go easy. At first blush , to persons who don't know you, this comes across quite "in-your-face". For those that know you longer, they realize differently , but .... go easy on new persons to the forum
This is followed by the scuba disclaimer "Don't try this at home"
This is followed by the scuba disclaimer "Don't try this at home"
Scuba, go easy. At first blush , to persons who don't know you, this comes across quite "in-your-face". For those that know you longer, they realize differently , but .... go easy on new persons to the forum
This is followed by the scuba disclaimer "Don't try this at home"
Tom, I think you know why I am not a state police officer and why I got out. I ADMIT, cops that attempt to squash my rights really irk me. I loved being a cop. I loved helping others like I do now with this hobby. ALL I do in life is help people. There is no reason for any officer to even talk to me when someone calls. BUT, if they do because they don't know the law themselves, I will help them and I have educated many. I have had some fantastic conversations with on duty LEO's
The ones that do NOT want to be educated are the problem. NOT ME. If you are a cop and feel because you have a gun and a badge, everyone should bow down to you and do as you say, WATCH OUT. Yes I stick up for myself. I should have done that after my parents were killed but I didn't. I use this hobby to help folks just like I did on here with my contests and advice.
I am very well liked where I live and play. Thousands of folks know what I do and how to reach me. I have saved a lot of sentimental valuables for folks with my detectors and my diving. My truck has everything to do with metal detecting and finding treasure. It is my passion and where I fit in at my age. Peace to all. Live your life the best you can and the way you feel fit.
BYW, on Facebook where I posted about my truck only ONE person gave me flack. Guess who. He was BANNED from Friendly. Gary Kemper.
Last edited:
KOB
Forum Supporter
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2019
- Messages
- 5,756
Ok...enquiring minds want to know. You gotta tell us the story about the homeowner going to the slammer ! And I call people behind a computer "Keyboard Commando's" or "Internet Toughguys".
They don't mean anything to me because they are just that.....a nothing....
They don't mean anything to me because they are just that.....a nothing....
Ok...enquiring minds want to know. You gotta tell us the story about the homeowner going to the slammer ! And I call people behind a computer "Keyboard Commando's" or "Internet Toughguys".
You want to hear that? Well I was detecting parking strips in SLC Utah. A homeowner came out and told me to get off his lawn. I told him that I was on public property. He pushed his coat aside and showed me a badge. I said so you are a cop? He said yes. I reached for my wallet to get out my badge. He said to keep my hands where he could see them. I said if you really are a cop you need to learn the law. I put my headphones back on and went back to detecting. He yelled, someone is going to jail, and went back into his house.
I kept detecting and two SLC police cars pulled up at an angle. I put my detector down, raised my hands and said I was a state cop and I was armed. One asked to see my identification. I gave it to him and told him what transpired. They knocked on the door, got him out and he was right. Someone went to jail for impersonating a peace officer and it wasn't me. He had a security guard badge on a leather holder on his belt.
