Feeling a little metal detecting jaded lately

[Tom_in_CA]

... in the past I had helped those employees find the cut off valves for the parks sprinkler system.

George-in-SC : You should be given a medal for your altruism and valor. Hat's off to you.

And yes, I too have been asked to help find sprinkler heads. And yes, I too understood that to be "blanket permission" to detect anywhere and everywhere, from there on out. And humorously, it is amazing how such lame answers are met with no questions. Ie.: "looking for a valve" or "looking for the boyscout ring my dad lost here when he was a kid", etc...... All very noble concerns. So we should be the most-to-be-commended !

 

[BaldAssCat]

And I have a sneaking suspicion of how that came-to-be in those towns. Care to take a guess ? I'll bet it was well-meaning sincere people before you that went in asking "Hi, Can I metal detect here in your parks ?" And sure as heck, someone invented a rule to invent the "pressing issue". The old "No one cared till you asked" psychology routine.



Which is exactly why I do most all of my nice manicured park turf hunting at night these days. So peaceful. So serene.

While that may have been part of it in this case I think it might more of a combination of the archeologists and local towns trying to save money.

In MA the archies got the department of conservation and recreation to close state property to metal detecting. All the state parks are run by them so state parks are out. They were also able to get the wildlife management areas closed so that another large chunk of land, more near me than North Shore though.

North Shore, living where he does has a lot of historical areas near him. Most of the towns in his area have given control of those areas and a lot of the local parks over to DCR, a money saving move for the towns as I understand it so those are closed to us now too. A lot of the towns in his area populated with the kind of people who like the idea so they made it a town rule. Those are the same kind of people who get bent out of shape over someone stealing the bottle cap collection they left in the park.

North Shore, if it's any consolation to you the entire state isn't like that. I've been confronted by a few people like and I get the police called in some areas pretty often, but the police have always just said hi, asked what I found and on a couple occasions mentioned a spot they thought would be good. The vast majority of people central / western MA ignore me. RI has been good to me so far too.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

... In MA the archies got the department of conservation and recreation to close state property to metal detecting. ....

I don't doubt that will be the "go to" answer. Ie.: Archaeological and "cultural heritage" concerns. Thus all of us md'rs mutter under our breath: "Durned them archies", eh ?

But this still doesn't answer the question of : "How did it end up, on an archie's desk, to give a yes-or-no IN THE FIRST PLACE " ?

I mean, do you really think that an archie , years ago, happen-chanced by an md'r in the sand-box or on the beach, and thought: "Oh me or my, we should make a law to reign in these yahoos" ?

No, I don't think that's how it ended up on their desks. Instead I think that "Can I ?" questions gets passed through-the-ranks of govt. officials. Of which, .... invariably .... there are admittedly staff archies on Govt. payrolls. At least at State, and nation, (and maybe even county-levels ?). And let's be honest , they (at least purist ones) hate md'rs.

So when the "no" gets passed out, we all lament "durned those archies". But no one seems to be asking themselves how it got on that archies plate (as a "pressing decision for him to make"), in the first place.

 

[BaldAssCat]

I don't doubt that will be the "go to" answer. Ie.: Archaeological and "cultural heritage" concerns. Thus all of us md'rs mutter under our breath: "Durned them archies", eh ?

But this still doesn't answer the question of : "How did it end up, on an archie's desk, to give a yes-or-no IN THE FIRST PLACE " ?

I mean, do you really think that an archie , years ago, happen-chanced by an md'r in the sand-box or on the beach, and thought: "Oh me or my, we should make a law to reign in these yahoos" ?

No, I don't think that's how it ended up on their desks. Instead I think that "Can I ?" questions gets passed through-the-ranks of govt. officials. Of which, .... invariably .... there are admittedly staff archies on Govt. payrolls. At least at State, and nation, (and maybe even county-levels ?). And let's be honest , they (at least purist ones) hate md'rs.

So when the "no" gets passed out, we all lament "durned those archies". But no one seems to be asking themselves how it got on that archies plate (as a "pressing decision for him to make"), in the first place.

It may be the case that people asking is what started it. It wasn't that long ago when the rules changed, maybe 2012 or 2014. I found out when a ranger at a local state park mentioned they were reviewing the rules at DCR and MDing would likely be restricted. I asked if he knew why and while he didn't claim first hand knowledge he blamed the archies. He said he thought they wanted to make it more like the federal parks. It was about a year later I started seeing the signs put up.

Again you may be right. We may have done this to ourselves. I'm firmly in the camp of public land not specifically called out is fair game and I'm not asking permission. But you may underestimate the level of smug that hangs in the air around Boston and Cambridge. I can't rule out a self started campaign from one of the colleges in the area.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... rules changed.....

Yes. And we can only ask ourselves : What caused those "rules to change" .

 

[GKL]

Yes. And we can only ask ourselves : What caused those "rules to change" .

Tom, the problem is while many of us on the forum understand your basic point of "IF you don't see a sign or a rule specifically forbidding metal detecting, then do NOT call and ask" there are likely many noobs out there who are not on this forum to read your sage advice and it could just take one such noob in each area to call and ask and cause such a rule to be made.

So maybe you can write up such advice and send it to each detector manufacturer asking them to include it in their manual under "tips for beginners" that way noobs can be informed as soon as they buy their first detector

(you could also include your rule about your 30% fee to detect in CA ) (just kidding )

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... maybe you can write up such advice and send it to each detector manufacturer asking them to include it in their manual under "tips for beginners"....

Ha, pretty funny. But then guess what would happen ? : THE MERE MENTION (in those instruction manuals) of potential hassle, will cause what ? Drum-roll : Those beginners to rush to the nearest bureaucrat's desks asking "Can I ?"

I saw this psychology unfold first-hand. Back in the day when no one would ever have thought of any such thing (after all, md'ing is harmless, right ?). So even the thought of thinking you needed to ask "Can I ?" would have been a foreign notion. But all that changed when even the mere notion of potential problems (eg.: an article in a magazine , or the formation of the FMDAC, etc...) arose. Then guess what those very same folks did ? Started showing up at desks everywhere, asking "Can I ?"

I think the instruction manuals already always include the "code of ethics" in them, right ? One of those points is "Know and obey all laws", if I'm not mistaken. The mere mention of that instills a notion that "there might be a law against us". So guess what they do, upon that *mere mention* of a notion ? Drumroll : Show up at desks asking "Can I ?"

So it's almost like ya can't win. The mere prospect of us hobbyists talking about it, spreads the very same fears that we're trying to stop. Uuugghh

 

[KOB]

Tom, the problem is while many of us on the forum understand your basic point of "IF you don't see a sign or a rule specifically forbidding metal detecting, then do NOT call and ask" there are likely many noobs out there who are not on this forum to read your sage advice and it could just take one such noob in each area to call and ask and cause such a rule to be made.

So maybe you can write up such advice and send it to each detector manufacturer asking them to include it in their manual under "tips for beginners" that way noobs can be informed as soon as they buy their first detector

(you could also include your rule about your 30% fee to detect in CA ) (just kidding )

Good write up on a solution for Tom. I think his consensus is to "just don't talk about it or even bring it up". Otherwise , it's the same old broken record on permissions. I can see it's a catch 22. Just because there's no sign saying specifically you can't MD , doesn't mean you can. How about signs everywhere that say you can MD here ?

 

[GKL]

Ha, pretty funny. But then guess what would happen ? : THE MERE MENTION (in those instruction manuals) of potential hassle, will cause what ? Drum-roll : Those beginners to rush to the nearest bureaucrat's desks asking "Can I ?"

I saw this psychology unfold first-hand. Back in the day when no one would ever have thought of any such thing (after all, md'ing is harmless, right ?). So even the thought of thinking you needed to ask "Can I ?" would have been a foreign notion. But all that changed when even the mere notion of potential problems (eg.: an article in a magazine , or the formation of the FMDAC, etc...) arose. Then guess what those very same folks did ? Started showing up at desks everywhere, asking "Can I ?"

I think the instruction manuals already always include the "code of ethics" in them, right ? One of those points is "Know and obey all laws", if I'm not mistaken. The mere mention of that instills a notion that "there might be a law against us". So guess what they do, upon that *mere mention* of a notion ? Drumroll : Show up at desks asking "Can I ?"

So it's almost like ya can't win. The mere prospect of us hobbyists talking about it, spreads the very same fears that we're trying to stop. Uuugghh

…..maybe under the "code of ethics" you'd have to spell it out very clearly for the noobs saying "do NOT call" or it might case a rule to be written, just look for signs and rules written online, and hope they understand

 

[maxxkatt]

I'm kind of down on the hobby currently, it is probably somewhat of a product of my environment.

I'm in a rut/dry spell lately and it stinks that when you do find something really cool that is identifiable in the way of jewelry the expectation is to then do due diligence and try and return it.

Pretty much everywhere public in my area is blanketed as "no metal detecting" and I have too much of a conscience to go against that knowingly

If I have researched an area and I am allowed to be there, I have had multiple confrontations from other people and taken sh*t and grief which results in me leaving because it isn't worth having a cop come down or something even if I was in the right the cop would ask me to leave

I have a mental block to ask a complete stranger for permission to dig holes in their yard, it just feels like a difficult thing to do and unnatural, there is every reason for them to say no and how could I blame them.

This is a difficult hobby at times, my most recent hunts have been more or less aimless walks through the woods without any real researched old activity, just because I wanted to get out.

I don't think I'm going to magically feel like I need to stand my ground on a site that I know I'm allowed at, to be as belligerent as the person giving me grief to begin with, and I certainly won't start night hawking. Maybe I can work up the nerve to ask for permissions.

Anyone else ever feel this way? Not trying to have a pity party, I never post on social medias or forums to vent I'm moreso just curious to see what people have to say... I find more reasons not to go out and make more excuses to not go out these days, detecting has more negative vibes for me lately which I'm bummed out about

I sent you a private message about permissions. This virus !!!! is probably getting us all down. I am in Atlanta and we don't have as many restrictions as MA where there may be more regulations. Plus up north I have found you have some of the more know it all type citizens who think they own the world. Not trying to be nasty, but down south even in Atlanta people tend to ignore other people and not worry about what they are doing. With many years detecting around Georgia, all I get from people who come up to me is they ask if I found anything good. So I think it is a regional culture thing.

Spend some more time on good research and use my method of getting permissions that produce good finds almost immediately. This will cheer you up.

 

[aeds151]

If it makes you feel better, today I went and detected a late 1800’s early 1900’s house that is boarded up. I didnt look to see who owned it or try to get permission. I spent about 5 hours there and found nothing.


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[North Shore]

I've been kicked out of a couple parks by city workers, and a few altercations with nosey people, but I generally have zero issues hunting just about anywhere. What county are you in? People are going to have issues eventually, and when they do, I just move on and go somewhere else. MA is a great state to live in for this hobby, I wouldn't let anyone get in the way of enjoying yourself. If there are no by-laws in that specific town in regards to metal detecting, I just go for it, 99.9% of the time I have no issues.

I took cellrdwellr's approach and hit the really undesirable areas of a city park in the greater Boston area and I was rewarded for my efforts. Had to work for this one, my first barber anything... Good slump buster and a natural endorphin high