Oh me oh my, all you Florida hunters are in BIG trouble :

In some countries there is the rule that yes, you have to turn in valuble items to see if owner claims it. But there you as the finder get a guarenteed 10% value of the item as a reward from the owner. So at least the finder gets something. If owner does not claim it then finder can keep it also. I like the guarenteed reward by law idea. I almost never accept a reward when I return items but having it written into law would be kind of fun.

Cfmct said:

Do you need lessons on how to quote a post?

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He's setting a new trend!

I have very bad luck. I only find gold plated and silver plated jewelry, so I'm off the hook!

I remember back in the 70s when the law was first introduced. All detectorists hated the idea because the way it was worded only made it so those doing the pillaging would keep pillaging, and only keep the legitimate hunters from their hobby.

It says something like it is against the law to remove anything of "archeological importance" be under ground or on top of the ground. And then they put the age of an "archeological item" at like anything over 50 years. Pretty much making it illegal to find and keep anything over 50 years, and then the newer items are supposed to be turned over to local authorities where they try and find the owner. After 30 days if no one comes to claim it you get it back. Problem was, anything of value always seemed to have someone come and claim it.

Federal Law. And yes there is something about being paid a finders fee in some cases.

Many hunters, including myself, also started hiding their finds because the government could come and confiscate their finds if they meet their idea of an archeological relic. The very reason most used anonymous names in the magazine articles, including myself, was for fear of being traced down and charged or have to pay taxes.

Detector said:

.... because the government could come and confiscate their finds if they meet their idea of an archeological relic. ....

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No. This would only happen if you publicized that you found some archaeological relic on land that's under the domain of some sort of cultural heritage rules (like a place under the scope of ARPA, for example).

To simply post a show & tell of an old coin or cool relic, without saying exactly where you found it, will not result in "confiscation" blah blah. Because who's to say you didn't find it on a city or county park or school ? (with no cultural heritage verbiage). Or at your friend's yard ? etc..

So you can even boast "in the desert" or "on the beach" or "in the forest" as part of your post.

FelixtheCat said:

He's setting a new trend!

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This is why you are a mod and he is not... he would have failed that part of the test

REAL_RAT_FINK said:

Thanks for stirring up the pot and reminding us that we are all vagrants, just trying to make a few dollars and support our families. I thought your motto was ignorance is bliss!

I guess it's a good thing in California it's not a misdemeanor as long as it's under $950

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So you are equating shoplifting to scavenging on a beach? That is a good one

Cfm-ct

Thanks > This is why you are a mod and he is not... he would have failed that part of the test ***** I am retired don't want the job , and your 100% correct , I couldn't handle the LONG term drama you all let go on & on PS When you retire , don't forget your JOB here is for life If Felix thinks your slacking , Ill bring you up some super beet chews , and get your blood pumping
__________________

Tom just likes to stir the pot. I'm the same way. My friends and relatives call me an instigator and an enabler! We're not troublemakers, we just like to get a rise out of people!

Tom_in_CA said:

No. This would only happen if you publicized that you found some archaeological relic on land that's under the domain of some sort of cultural heritage rules (like a place under the scope of ARPA, for example).

To simply post a show & tell of an old coin or cool relic, without saying exactly where you found it, will not result in "confiscation" blah blah. Because who's to say you didn't find it on a city or county park or school ? (with no cultural heritage verbiage). Or at your friend's yard ? etc..

So you can even boast "in the desert" or "on the beach" or "in the forest" as part of your post.

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At the time everyone was unsure how the Federal government would react..

1979 law: https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid%3AUSC-prelim-title16-chapter1B&saved=%7CKHRpdGxlOjE2IHNlY3Rpb246NDcwYWEgZWRpdGlvbjpwcmVsaW0pIE9SIChncmFudWxlaWQ6VVNDLXByZWxpbS10aXRsZTE2LXNlY3Rpb240NzBhYSk%3D%7CdHJlZXNvcnQ%3D%7C%7C0%7Cfalse%7Cprelim&edition=prelim

Definitions
As used in this chapter—

(1) The term "archaeological resource" means any material remains of past human life or activities which are of archaeological interest, as determined under uniform regulations promulgated pursuant to this chapter. Such regulations containing such determination shall include, but not be limited to: pottery, basketry, bottles, weapons, weapon projectiles, tools, structures or portions of structures, pit houses, rock paintings, rock carvings, intaglios, graves, human skeletal materials, or any portion or piece of any of the foregoing items. Nonfossilized and fossilized paleontological specimens, or any portion or piece thereof, shall not be considered archaeological resources, under the regulations under this paragraph, unless found in archaeological context. No item shall be treated as an archaeological resource under regulations under this paragraph unless such item is at least 100 years of age.

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Tom... all dirt hunters are breaking the law in Connecticut

Metal Detecting in Connecticut?
You Should Know the Law!
STATE OF CONNECTICUT DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION BUREAU OF OUTDOOR RECREATION, STATE PARKS DIVISION

POLICY/PROCEDURE #312 October 31, 2002SUBJECT: METAL DETECTION - COLLECTING GUIDELINES SECTION INDEX: I. USE OF METAL DETECTION DEVICES

I. USE OF METAL DETECTION DEVICES

The use of metal detection devices is permitted on land under the jurisdiction of the Department of Environmental Protection under the following conditions:

1. The activity shall be limited to surface collection except at beach areas where digging is permitted in sand areas devoid of vegetation. However no collecting or digging will be allowed in areas of sand dunes adjoining the beach area proper. Digging must be done by hand with all motorized devices prohibited. All holes dug must be refilled immediately before the collector leaves the site.

2. The use of metal detection devices will only be permitted when the beach is not being used by the public for other purposes.

3. Persons using a metal detector are required to use a trash apron to store all materials found. The collector may retain articles found, except items of a personal nature such as jewelry and watches, which must be turned into the manager in charge. Any material the collector does not wish to retain shall be placed in a waste receptacle.

4. No specific permit is required at this time.

5. Staff may close any area to this activity for purposes of maintaining visitor safety and/or preserving significant artifactual remains.

There is no metal detecting in Connecticut at these State Park areas.

If you get caught metal detecting in Connecticut parks you can be prosecuted.

Continental Army Hospital Memorial - West Hartford Dinosaur - Rocky Hill Ft. Griswold Battlefield - Groton Ft. Trumbull – New London Gay City – Hebron Gillette Castle – East Haddam (prohibition includes all of the park property adjacent to the CT River.)Industrial Monument – North Canaan Macedonia Brook – Kent Mashamoquet Brook – Pomfret Putnam Memorial - Redding

Remember, you can metal detect in Connecticut, however, you just can’t dig any artifact that is one hundred years old.

Detecting on State beaches is allowed if you get a permit. Be careful. You need to ask if your permit is just for the beach area. Some States do not allow detecting outside of the beaches even with a permit.

https://www.metal-detecting-ghost-towns-of-the-east.com/metal-detecting-in-Connecticut.html

Just Wondering

If Tom's a under cover Fed Agent ,

Cfmct said:

Tom... all dirt hunters are breaking the law in Connecticut .....


https://www.metal-detecting-ghost-towns-of-the-east.com/metal-detecting-in-Connecticut.html

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thanx. I enjoyed reading that. And : All that you copied/pasted is for type(s) of state land. Not other forms of land . Eg.: City, county, private, fed. But notice the caption/title, preceding your quote, is as follows :

" Metal Detecting in Connecticut?
You Should Know the Law! "

Notice that they make no differentiation/distinction. Therefore the average newbie skittish reader will take that to mean : "All of Connecticut". And then, sure as heck, guess how they'll go to find out ? "Just to be sure" ? So that they don't get "prosecuted" ? You guessed it : Waltz into offices, hither & yonder, seeking approvals and express "yes's". And then the vicious "No one cared UNTIL you asked" cycle continues.



Notice that the entire citation you quote is from 10/31/2002. Fairly recently. I'll bet I know how/why this was penned, by some state pencil-pusher there. Care to take a guess ?

That website (where you can alphabetically click on each of the 50 states) just broils my blood !!

But thanks for the fun read this morning

Detector said:

At the time everyone was unsure how the Federal government would react..

1979 law: https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid%3AUSC-prelim-title16-chapter1B&saved=%7CKHRpdGxlOjE2IHNlY3Rpb246NDcwYWEgZWRpdGlvbjpwcmVsaW0pIE9SIChncmFudWxlaWQ6VVNDLXByZWxpbS10aXRsZTE2LXNlY3Rpb240NzBhYSk%3D%7CdHJlZXNvcnQ%3D%7C%7C0%7Cfalse%7Cprelim&edition=prelim

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I never find items over 100 yrs. old on federal land. DO YOU ?

And no : ARPA does not subrogate downwards to sub-entities within the larger fed. So for example, even though states are a sub-entity with the larger fed, does not mean ARPA necessarily applies to state land. And even though counties are a sub-entity within the larger state, does not mean that county parks are necessarily subject to the larger state. And so forth down the pecking order.

Laws/rules/codes differ ALL THE TIME between various entities and agencies. Some allow fireworks, others don't. Some require dogs on leash, others don't. Some close at sunset, others don't.

Thus just because ARPA is federal, does not mean that you are in some sort of trouble if you find a 101 yr. old penny at a city park, or your neighbor's yard, etc....

Tom_in_CA said:

thanx. I enjoyed reading that. And : All that you copied/pasted is for type(s) of state land. Not other forms of land . Eg.: City, county, private, fed. But notice the caption/title, preceding your quote, is as follows :

" Metal Detecting in Connecticut?
You Should Know the Law! "

Notice that they make no differentiation/distinction. Therefore the average newbie skittish reader will take that to mean : "All of Connecticut". And then, sure as heck, guess how they'll go to find out ? "Just to be sure" ? So that they don't get "prosecuted" ? You guessed it : Waltz into offices, hither & yonder, seeking approvals and express "yes's". And then the vicious "No one cared UNTIL you asked" cycle continues.



Notice that the entire citation you quote is from 10/31/2002. Fairly recently. I'll bet I know how/why this was penned, by some state pencil-pusher there. Care to take a guess ?

That website (where you can alphabetically click on each of the 50 states) just broils my blood !!

But thanks for the fun read this morning

Click to expand...

Its ok if the new guy reads that into it more for us scavengers

Cfmct said:

Its ok if the new guy reads that into it more for us scavengers

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Funny that you put it that way. My long-time hunt partner sometimes asks me: "Why do you care ? Doesn't that just mean more for us ? ". And in a way, you and him are right.

Still though, the psychology and evolution of it fascinates me (to a fault, I know )

Persons using a metal detector are required to use a trash apron to store all materials found.

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Trash apron? I'll stick to my Garrett pouch, thank you!

FreeBirdTim said:

Trash apron? I'll stick to my Garrett pouch, thank you!

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Nope. Can't you read ? The law doesn't say "Garrett Pouch". It says "Trash Apron".

So your choices are simple :

1) You can choose to be a bad ambassador for our hobby. And flagrantly violate the laws. And thus give a bad name to the rest of us. Not to mention the risk of arrests, prosecutions, and confiscations !! Or

2) You can petition and appeal to the highest levels. To "clarify" this subject. After all, you can't be too safe. Be sure to get it in writing, lest they deny they said it later.

Tom_in_CA said:

I never find items over 100 yrs. old on federal land. DO YOU ?

And no : ARPA does not subrogate downwards to sub-entities within the larger fed. So for example, even though states are a sub-entity with the larger fed, does not mean ARPA necessarily applies to state land. And even though counties are a sub-entity within the larger state, does not mean that county parks are necessarily subject to the larger state. And so forth down the pecking order.

Laws/rules/codes differ ALL THE TIME between various entities and agencies. Some allow fireworks, others don't. Some require dogs on leash, others don't. Some close at sunset, others don't.

Thus just because ARPA is federal, does not mean that you are in some sort of trouble if you find a 101 yr. old penny at a city park, or your neighbor's yard, etc....

Click to expand...

Prohibited acts and criminal penalties
(a) Unauthorized excavation, removal, damage, alteration, or defacement of archaeological resources
No person may excavate, remove, damage, or otherwise alter or deface, or attempt to excavate, remove, damage, or otherwise alter or deface any archaeological resource located on public lands or Indian lands unless such activity is pursuant to a permit issued under section 470cc of this title, a permit referred to in section 470cc(h)(2) of this title, or the exemption contained in section 470cc(g)(1) of this title.

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't the Federal laws apply IF there are no state laws to cover? My understanding is this protection of archeological sites covers public land also.

Detector said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't the Federal laws apply IF there are no state laws to cover? My understanding is this protection of archeological sites covers public land also.

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No. ARPA (federal law) does not subrogate downwards to lower level entities (state, county, city, private).

That's not to say that individual states might not ALSO have some cultural heritage verbiage in their *own* state park park wording. Which, likewise, would not necessarily subrogate down to county or city level.

A lower/sub-entity might reference ARPA, to be included *by specific mention*. But not, it is not OF NECESSITY subrogated downwards, simply because the state (and city, and county) are sub-components of the larger fed. It's not like murder, theft, etc... where, sure, a city doesn't need to "outlaw murder", in order to make murder wrong.

Because, think of it : Take a quick look at our show & tell sections, on any md'ing forums. Correct me if I'm wrong, but : You will see no shortage of 101+ yr. old coins being shown as bragging rights among our ranks. Right ? And we even say things like "found in the park" or "found on the beach", etc.... Eh ?

If ARPA automatically subrogated downwards, then ..... are we to conclude that every single one of these posts is a violation of law ?