Police called on me for curb strip hunting

[BRJ123]

Really ? I think you are out-numbered. I don't think you'll find any allies on this forum who agree with you that: A passenger who steps on to the grass, while exiting a vehicle from the passenger side door, has "trespassed".

If what you are saying is true, then sure: Everything else you're saying logically follows.

Hi Tom, I don't care who agrees or disagrees with me. That is for children trying to fit in at school.

 

[pplinker]

I also would recommend to anyone before criticizing police officers or their tactics to try walking in their shoes. They might gain a little more respect for them when they see the !!!! they go through on a daily basis. I find it hard to criticize anyone who puts on a uniform either military, police or fire and takes an oath to protect me even if it means they may lose their life doing so. Sure, there are bad cops, we all know that but in my experience, which is extensive, most of them are just good people trying to make a difference no matter how small.

You are correct, and I shouldn't have made a disparaging remark, even though I was just venting on this forum. Most policemen really are good and honorable. Of course then there are those four uniformed deputies in the Florida school shooting who hunkered down behind cars. They took an oath to protect until it came to that part of losing their life to do it. The only one you can count on to die for you has already done it.

 

[pplinker]

I hunt the strips a lot BUT I don’t if it’s evident that area is being cared for. Legal or not, it’s common courtesy. Also if someone objects I explain the law but still will move on.
Also I do it during working hours when most people are at work to avoid contact and hassle. And I wear a fluorescent vest for safety but also it makes me look like a municipal worker and people leave them alone.
It sounds to me like you wanted a fight. You got one. But now you’re on the police’s radar and you’ve been warned. If the same cops see you again you might get more than the warning. That’s why I would have avoided the issue.

Yes, I read that in another post of yours and at the time I sincerely said that it was kind of clever to try to look like a municipal worker and hunt those curb strips. But hey, according to you, I'm just the type that wants to pick a fight. So i'll just say this. You are impersonating a municipal worker. That's not too kosher when you think about.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Back in the mid to late 1980s, someone in our club "got it in his brain" that parking strips were fair game. So he chose a bunch of 1940s/50s neighborhoods, and merely started up one side, and back down the other. Block after block, every few days. Got a bunch of common wheaties and silver doing this. And for the most part, was largely ignored , even if-seen.

But one day however he did run into someone making a hissy fit. My friend tried to explain the public access/right of way. But the griper wasn't having any part of it. And was threatening to call the cops. Well my friend, being the .... uh ... *obstinate* sort, told the guy: "Go ahead". And then he purposefully kept detecting.

5 or 10 min. later, a cop pulls up. He hears both parties sides of the story. Then they pulled my friend aside and told him "You're in the right. However, do us a favor, and go around the block to resume your hobby. Because we just want to keep the peace ".

Notice that the cops agreed with the md'r, as for the basic premise of it. NOT SAYING IT'S ALWAYS A GOOD IDEA (just like nose-picking: There's right times and wrong times to do it). But ... just sayin' ... there was an example of the cops siding with the md'r. Perhaps they were mistaken but ........ just sayin' ....

 

[BRJ123]

Back in the mid to late 1980s, someone in our club "got it in his brain" that parking strips were fair game. So he chose a bunch of 1940s/50s neighborhoods, and merely started up one side, and back down the other. Block after block, every few days. Got a bunch of common wheaties and silver doing this. And for the most part, was largely ignored , even if-seen.

But one day however he did run into someone making a hissy fit. My friend tried to explain the public access/right of way. But the griper wasn't having any part of it. And was threatening to call the cops. Well my friend, being the .... uh ... *obstinate* sort, told the guy: "Go ahead". And then he purposefully kept detecting.

5 or 10 min. later, a cop pulls up. He hears both parties sides of the story. Then they pulled my friend aside and told him "You're in the right. However, do us a favor, and go around the block to resume your hobby. Because we just want to keep the peace ".

Notice that the cops agreed with the md'r, as for the basic premise of it. NOT SAYING IT'S ALWAYS A GOOD IDEA (just like nose-picking: There's right times and wrong times to do it). But ... just sayin' ... there was an example of the cops siding with the md'r. Perhaps they were mistaken but ........ just sayin' ....

Hi Tom, not that I really want to extend our dumb internet battle, but since you like the hypotheticals...how come you never answered this?

in another hypothetical If you're cool with people doing innocuous things on your property would you be cool with someone coming in your house and checking things out, watching the TV you have on maybe eating their takeout on your counter (they wiped up afterward so its innocuous). Hitting up the toilet (but flushing and washing their hands so its innocuous)...you'd never even know they were there right? so it must be fine.

I am also curious about another hypothetical regarding your passenger getting out of a car theory.

Say I had some really really expensive plants that produced gold coins instead of fruit and $100 bills instead of leaves. They only live in the magical soil which makes up my curb strip which I own to the street...if they are stepped on they die instantly and poison the magic soil which will never bear these plants again...

someone pulls up and lets out a passenger who steps on my property and on one of my plants...are they responsible?

 

[woodbutcher]

Actually I am well aware we do because of a conflict our neighborhood got into about removing trees from the strips. I was surprised to find out that indeed the land is owned to the street by the homeowner and removing the trees was within the right of the neighborhood and such they won the court battle...a battle I hope nobody else has to endure.

There’s exceptions in anything so I believe you.I was just going by my dealings in various counties here in Pennsylvania.I wish all neighborhoods in Pennsylvania were like yours tho,I get tired of filling permits out.lol

 

[Barry]

I see your in Pennsylvania..Me too.And we don't own that strip of grass,trust me I'm posative.. Although I would move on before a major conflict,it's not totally necessary

Is there a Tampa Bay in Pennsylvania..??

 

[woodbutcher]

Is there a Tampa Bay in Pennsylvania..??

I only wish,I’d love to go beach hunting just once.lol..Sorry about that Barry,I meant to respond to brj123 and somehow got it mixed up ..

 

[ScubaDetective]

This is VERY INTERESTING! I have walked a mile in cops shoes and I have been exactly where the OP has been.

As Ron said, LAWS VARY state to state. I have been confronted by homeowners and and I have had cops called on me many many times.

IF you know the law and you want to push it I say GO FOR IT. If you THINK you know the law and the police come, I would LEAVE until I KNEW THE LAW.

Most cops have NO IDEA what the law is. They appease the public. PERIOD.

While hunting curb strips I had confrontations with home owners. One called the police, and said someone was going to jail. He was absolutely right, HE DID.

NINE times in one lake the police were called on me. SIX times the police said I was within the law. The 7th I was told I was breaking the law. I asked for the officer to call his superior. He came and also said I was breaking the law. I DEMANDED a citation before I left. It was DISMISSED. I was NOT breaking the law.

I have received SIX citations for detecting and ALL have been dismissed. I will not back down to an officer.

This has come up many many many times. Do you want your rights trampled on or do you want to stick up for them. Your call, nobody can tell you what to do.

Just like the police chief that wanted to take the gun I found from me. He was breaking the law himself.

Some here think I am crazy for backing the police into a corner. Well I am not dead yet and I have never been on the wrong side of a jail cell.

Badge, lights, guns, color of authority mean absolutely NOTHING if the officer attempts to intimidate me outside the law. The Wayne county sheriff department and others have found out the hard way with me.

You folks do what you want. I was a cop for 9 years and I know their games. MOST officers I have talked to because they have been called on me have been FANTASTIC. Others, I have had to put in their place.

I can quote Michigan law, I keep a copy of a few Michigan laws in my truck and in my boat. I also have my drivers license memorized to give them so they can run it. Some officers ALLOW you to educate them and are appreciative and absolutely friendly. Others think they can intimidate anyone they want. I have fun with the second group.

 

[Barry]

You are correct, and I shouldn't have made a disparaging remark, even though I was just venting on this forum. Most policemen really are good and honorable. Of course then there are those four uniformed deputies in the Florida school shooting who hunkered down behind cars. They took an oath to protect until it came to that part of losing their life to do it. The only one you can count on to die for you has already done it.

No officer took an oath to protect you, it was taken to uphold the Constitution...

Justices Rule Police Do Not Have a Constitutional Duty to Protect Someone.

The Supreme Court ruled on Monday, June 5th 2005, that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect a person from harm.


You going back to your Adam-12 days where it said "To serve and Protect" and somehow you just made it law..There is no legal or moral obligation to die for you (of course many have)..and while your at it, they were told to stage...Look it up and see what that means....

 

[BRJ123]

There’s exceptions in anything so I believe you.I was just going by my dealings in various counties here in Pennsylvania.I wish all neighborhoods in Pennsylvania were like yours tho,I get tired of filling permits out.lol

That's what the whole thing was about...some folks in the neighborhood got together and decided to take down some huge trees in their strips without permits. The township must have received a bunch of complaints from other members in the community and decided they would give these folks x amount of days to replace the trees as well as be fined for skirting the rules. yada yada yada....turns out the homeowners own the strips lol

 

[Barry]

I only wish,I’d love to go beach hunting just once.lol..Sorry about that Barry,I meant to respond to brj123 and somehow got it mixed up ..

I was joking with ya....When ya come, gimme a shout and Ill show you the hot spots...(Ok warm..)

 

[pplinker]

No officer took an oath to protect you, it was taken to uphold the Constitution...

Justices Rule Police Do Not Have a Constitutional Duty to Protect Someone.

The Supreme Court ruled on Monday, June 5th 2005, that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect a person from harm.


You going back to your Adam-12 days where it said "To serve and Protect" and somehow you just made it law..There is no legal or moral obligation to die for you (of course many have)..and while your at it, they were told to stage...Look it up and see what that means....

Barry, thank you for that helpful post. But you are talking about Adam-12 days and that isn't where I got that information about the police taking an oath to serve and protect. Pescadore said that the police take an oath to serve and protect. Then I repeated it, thinking that he was right. It sounds reasonable anyway, but I should have fact checked that. Hopefully he will read this and learn, like I have, that the police don't take an oath to serve and protect.

 

[Barry]

Barry, thank you for that helpful post. But you are talking about Adam-12 days and that isn't where I got that information about the police taking an oath to serve and protect. Pescadore said that the police take an oath to serve and protect. Then I repeated it, thinking that he was right. It sounds reasonable anyway, but I should have fact checked that. Hopefully he will read this and learn, like I have, that the police don't take an oath to serve and protect.

 

[pescadore]

Barry, thank you for that helpful post. But you are talking about Adam-12 days and that isn't where I got that information about the police taking an oath to serve and protect. Pescadore said that the police take an oath to serve and protect. Then I repeated it, thinking that he was right. It sounds reasonable anyway, but I should have fact checked that. Hopefully he will read this and learn, like I have, that the police don't take an oath to serve and protect.

My Bad, Barry is exactly right !!! It was the Texas Police Association Code of Ethics that I was remembering from my earlier years. Here is a copy of the Code of Ethics.

LAW ENFORCEMENT CODE OF ETHICS

AS A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER, my fundamental duty is to serve the community; to safeguard lives and property; to protect the innocent against deception, the weak against oppression or intimidation, and the peaceful against violence or disorder; and to respect the Constitutional rights of all persons to liberty, equality and justice.

I WILL keep my private life unsullied as an example to all, and will conduct myself in a manner that does not bring discredit to me or to my agency. I will maintain courageous calm in the face of danger, scorn or ridicule; develop self-restraint; and be constantly mindful of the welfare of others. Honest in thought and deed in both my personal and official life, I will be exemplary in obeying the laws of the land and the regulations of my department. Whatever I see or hear of a confidential nature or that is confided to me in my official capacity will be kept ever secret unless revelation is necessary in the performance of my duty.

I WILL never act officiously or permit personal feelings, prejudices, political beliefs, aspirations, animosities or friendships to influence my decisions. With no compromise for crime and with relentless prosecution of criminals, I will enforce the law courteously and appropriately without fear or favor, malice or ill will, never employing unnecessary force or violence and never accepting gratuities.

I RECOGNIZE the badge of my office as a symbol of public faith and I accept it as a public trust to be held so long as I am true to the ethics of the police service. I will never engage in acts of corruption or bribery, nor will I condone such acts by other police officers. I will cooperate with all legally authorized agencies and their representatives in the pursuit of justice.

I KNOW that I alone am responsible for my own standard of professional performance and will take every reasonable opportunity to enhance and improve my level of knowledge and competence.

I WILL constantly strive to achieve these objectives and ideals, dedicating myself before God to my chosen profession....

 

[pplinker]

Thanks Pescadore. Well at least I know that much more about the law, more than yesterday, anyway.

I'm done with curb strips anyway.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Hi Tom, not that I really want to extend our dumb internet battle, but since you like the hypotheticals...how come you never answered this?....

"in another hypothetical If you're cool with people doing innocuous things on your property would you be cool with someone coming in your house and checking things out, watching the TV you have on maybe eating their takeout on your counter (they wiped up afterward so its innocuous). Hitting up the toilet (but flushing and washing their hands so its innocuous)...you'd never even know they were there right? so it must be fine."

BRJ-123: The problem with this question, is it equates coming inside your house, and watching TV, as being equal to and analogous to someone walking on , or md'ing on the curb strip. But the difference is: the curb strip DOES have public access right-of-way. Whereas your living room where your TV is, and using your bathroom, etc... DOES NOT have that same public access right-of-way.

Hence how can you make such a non-parallel question ?

If it's true that the parking strips are every bit of private as your living room , then your question makes sense. Which would mean that all passengers who step foot out their car door onto your curb strip, are every bit as rude and obnoxious and someone barging into your living room and watching your TV. The 2 are not comparable.

....Say I had some really really expensive plants that produced gold coins instead of fruit and $100 bills instead of leaves. They only live in the magical soil which makes up my curb strip which I own to the street...if they are stepped on they die instantly and poison the magic soil which will never bear these plants again...

someone pulls up and lets out a passenger who steps on my property and on one of my plants...are they responsible?

Sorry bro, I lost ya here. But I'm going to assume that the analogy you are trying to draw from this is : The md'r is analogous to the person who just destroyed the $100 bill-bearing plant. Right ? And the analogy you'll draw is that the md'r is .... likewise .... doing damage that costs the homeowner $$. Right ?

So to make this example/analogy work, we're back to square one in assuming that : "MD'ing = mayhem, damage, and destruction". If this premise is true, then yes, your $100 plant analogy is true. And then by all means, don't detect. In fact, Don't detect even in parks, schools, and beaches. Because the same horrid-ness exists there too (and laws to forbid destruction and damage)

But why this starting premise If you do that type damage when you detect, I kindly suggest you repeat the "target recovery 101 class".

 

[Tom_in_CA]

This is VERY INTERESTING! I have walked a mile in cops shoes and I have been exactly where the OP has been.

As Ron said, LAWS VARY state to state. I have been confronted by homeowners and and I have had cops called on me many many times.

IF you know the law and you want to push it I say GO FOR IT. If you THINK you know the law and the police come, I would LEAVE until I KNEW THE LAW.

Most cops have NO IDEA what the law is. They appease the public. PERIOD.

While hunting curb strips I had confrontations with home owners. One called the police, and said someone was going to jail. He was absolutely right, HE DID.

NINE times in one lake the police were called on me. SIX times the police said I was within the law. The 7th I was told I was breaking the law. I asked for the officer to call his superior. He came and also said I was breaking the law. I DEMANDED a citation before I left. It was DISMISSED. I was NOT breaking the law.

I have received SIX citations for detecting and ALL have been dismissed. I will not back down to an officer.

This has come up many many many times. Do you want your rights trampled on or do you want to stick up for them. Your call, nobody can tell you what to do.

Just like the police chief that wanted to take the gun I found from me. He was breaking the law himself.

Some here think I am crazy for backing the police into a corner. Well I am not dead yet and I have never been on the wrong side of a jail cell.

Badge, lights, guns, color of authority mean absolutely NOTHING if the officer attempts to intimidate me outside the law. The Wayne county sheriff department and others have found out the hard way with me.

You folks do what you want. I was a cop for 9 years and I know their games. MOST officers I have talked to because they have been called on me have been FANTASTIC. Others, I have had to put in their place.

I can quote Michigan law, I keep a copy of a few Michigan laws in my truck and in my boat. I also have my drivers license memorized to give them so they can run it. Some officers ALLOW you to educate them and are appreciative and absolutely friendly. Others think they can intimidate anyone they want. I have fun with the second group.

Scuba, your stories are the stuff of legend. You are a great asset to the md'ing forums, discussions, etc....

And while what you are saying has proven to be statistically legally true, yet .... we've had this discussion before: It's not for the "faint of heart". As much as I believe all that you've gone through that you prevailed in, yet I would much rather "give lip service" and "out of sight is out of mind".

You have shown that an md'r CAN prevail (when in fact he's broken no law). But unless they have thick skin like you do, and a back-ground in law enforcement like you do, it's not something to suggest that everyone does.

One time I too got p*ssed at what I felt was an un-justified officer reaction to a metal detecting incident. He pulled a gun on me (long story). I ended up complaining to his superiors. The long story short is: That officer was demoted and never carried a gun again ! He was relegated to a desk job from then on out. Would I recommend it to anyone else ? H*LL N*. But just saying: Sometimes md'rs should stop this "must grovel everywhere" nonsense too.

 

[papaharley03]

Here in Texas, most sidewalk strips are owned by the owner of the lot on the other side of the sidewalk.

There are exceptions though. In my city, the city owns the sidewalk, the curb strip, street, opposite curb strip and side walk. I did check on the county GIS and confirmed with my detector where my boundary stakes are at. But like most, I do maintain the turf in the curb strip, and I wouldn’t hunt one without asking, even if the homeowner doesn’t really own it.

As i many cases, it comes down to what you should do, vs. what you can legally do.

 

[ScubaDetective]

Scuba, your stories are the stuff of legend. You are a great asset to the md'ing forums, discussions, etc....

And while what you are saying has proven to be statistically legally true, yet .... we've had this discussion before: It's not for the "faint of heart". As much as I believe all that you've gone through that you prevailed in, yet I would much rather "give lip service" and "out of sight is out of mind".

You have shown that an md'r CAN prevail (when in fact he's broken no law). But unless they have thick skin like you do, and a back-ground in law enforcement like you do, it's not something to suggest that everyone does.

One time I too got p*ssed at what I felt was an un-justified officer reaction to a metal detecting incident. He pulled a gun on me (long story). I ended up complaining to his superiors. The long story short is: That officer was demoted and never carried a gun again ! He was relegated to a desk job from then on out. Would I recommend it to anyone else ? H*LL N*. But just saying: Sometimes md'rs should stop this "must grovel everywhere" nonsense too.

Tom,

I said that in my post. I don't suggest anybody govern themselves the way I do. I do think folks need to know the laws as to what they are doing instead of relying on what they hear on here or elsewhere. If someone sticks up for themselves because of what I posted and finds themselves in jail it is their problem.

I do know for a FACT that a police officer cannot and does not know the law in most instances. I also know for a FACT they have to make people THINK they can do something when they really can't.

Just the sight of my lights and uniform intimidated a lot of folks. Even folks that were guilty of absolutely nothing.

Know the laws in your state. Know your rights. If an officer decides to infringe on your rights, either pack up or fight. Absolutely your choice on how to govern yourself.