MId-West Refineries test

[OBN]

Gave the GF some gold to send in, want to see if we could figure out how they work, little disappointed in the return.
I got pictures of all, weight of each ring, total weight, fineness marks(K), acid tested of each ring, magnet test, and record of the gold price at 10am, 11am, 12am.

Gold opened Thursday the 19th at 1947.00 and by end of day price was 1972.00, they Paid 1948.00 ..which I figure falls into the timeline they processed the package.

My scales total weight was 32.83 grams...their weight was 1.05 Troy ounces.. which is right on.

This is where we differed and New acid was ordered / used.
My Gold fineness, acid tested and marked... (5) 10k rings 27.02 grams and (1) 14k ring 5.79 grams
Theirs total 0.38 troy ounces = 10.77 24k gold -------- which equals out to 9k gold on each ring.

I figured 10k for all would be $859.00 minus 5% $42.95 equals $816.05
The check was for $703.00

At one time I thought they were buying the gold out right and paying 12k for all under 3 ounces, I was wrong.
All I can figure is they are using a Handheld XRF Gold Analyzer to get the purity of each piece of gold, than totaling. Or one of the rings was not real? Which I doubt since I rubbed them hard and test each twice. And I remember someone here posting most gold rings are not what they are stamped and can be a little less...........and since none of the 6 were marked with a (P) Plumb.

Last year I did the same, gave the GF a batch to send in.. it came back 10% (15%) under what I had estimated, this time it was 13% (18%) and this is figuring in there 5% fee. Will I use MidWest again.. ?

I don't feel cheated for I see they are there to make money and if I am right on the Analyzer gun the check was fair. But I am going to start looking around for a better source locally. If I can get 90% of what the gold is marked (K) I see me going that way.

Fineness marked,....(5) 10k rings 27.02 grams and (1) 14k ring 5.79 grams

Total weight 32.83 grams........1.05 troy ounces....................................................................New Acid Kit

Acid test ........all passed as marked

 

[Beachhunt1]

Thanks OBN. Duly noted!

 

[KOB]

Well there you go. Letting your little head do all the thinking. Whenever I gave my GF gold , it was always a losing proposition. The new acid was a smart move. There will always be a discrepancy no matter what you do unless it is melted. Best you find someone else.

I recently sold a big 14k chain to my XRF guy. When it was melted , he said it was 12.8 kt. Not much you think , but in the volume it was a good chunk of change. He ate that one. So now , he wants to cut into everything to use his machine. Especially rings and thick chains which are now totally destroyed. Before I sell them ! I've seen the results and I can see his point. But now I think I gotta look elsewhere. If it's marked , 14k and it passes my 14k acid test , I want 14k prices. I try to get 85-90% of spot. Most don't want to pay this. Now if my XRF guy can't destroy my jewelry , pre-sale , he low balls me. Saying " the machine is not exactly accurate if I don't do this." It's all a scam to me , getting way too technical.

I'm now thinking of going back to hoarding and maybe getting a table top smelter and pouring my own. Take up another little hobby.

 

[GroundSweeper]

Good to know, thank you!

 

[John Madill]

Very interesting, thanks!

 

[Slimpickuns]

Yea I'm not surprised about Midwest Refineries, I stopped using them after a few of my payouts were way lower then what I calculated. The last shipment of scrap gold I sent to ARA back in January came back pretty spot on to my calculations, though the processing time is slower then Midwest. I'm sticking with ARA for future scrap gold shipments.

 

[cellrdwellr]

Never used any of those services, only because I had a local buyer that gave me more than what I wanted for my gold. Unfortunately he retired last winter, so I'll be on the lookout for other options. Haven't found any gold since last year anyway so I got time appreciate you sharing your experience.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Hey OBN : Thanx for the full play-by-play and pix . As for the price-per-ounce they pay, I thought they go by the : Week it arrived. Whatever the low point/price of gold was, that week. So as to hedge their risk on the rise & fall of the market. NOT the "exact hour they open your envelope". This is because, go figure : They are compiling tons of submissions that are mailed to them daily. And are no doubt selling to their up-line in single weekly or monthly bulk sales. Ie.: *they too* are merely selling to a buyer/broker.


Midwest is merely acting as a smelter/refiner, with overhead of having to deal with all these small-fry submissions from geeks like us. And their end result is giant cubes of certified gold or silver that, they in turn, have industrial/commercial level buyers above them .

I've heard of some mid-west users who felt they got a bit better than they expected . D/t some sort of averaging formula. And that midwest isn't "turning themselves into pretzels" with each individual submissions, to get exact separations.

I used Midwest a month or so ago, and was not disappointed. Granted, I did not go through the exacting calculations and acid test studies-for-purity that you did. But the turn-around time was fast. And they never asked for my SS# (so it's not dealing with 1099s, eh ?). And even if I DID end up with, say, 90% (10% refiners' cut), instead of 95% (5% refiners' cut), it is still a HECK OF A LOT BETTER percentage than any brick & mortar walk-in place, on the street corner, that is advertising "We Buy Gold"

 

[jmaclen]

I have used Midwest Refineries many times. There is minimal paperwork, no issues and a check is in my my hands within 2 weeks of me shipping the items. My check is usually 7 or 8% below what I estimated as total melt value. So not exactly 95% payout but close enough for my math.

 

[johnny utah]

OBN Great write up
I watched a documentary where they actually took gold marked - tested it all before
then smelted the gold jewelry - some were in necklace form others in ring
they took all stones out
- they checked purity of each some items were spot on marked 14k
others tested out to 12k - same with 10k items - they were not always exactly the same
or all 10k - unless of course if it was marked plumb - those 14k items were always 14 to 15k in purity
they did all this to see how honest the jewelers were who they were buying from
a few were quite deceptive
it was very interesting -
i too weigh up all items beforehand
last batch i sent to them was pretty close - other times a little off
i did like ARA before but i think they now require 1099 & such
which i don't agree with IRS isn't paying for my gas - equipment - park pass
time & such while i go out looking for - not to mention when u strike out
thx for play by play - by the way all your gold in pics obv is real
also too i've always thought anyone u send it to can easily shave a little off without being noticed much

 

[Beachhunt1]

i did like ARA before but i think they now require 1099 & such

I tried sending my last batch to ARA and they require the person to be a business. You must submit your federal business Tax/EIN number.

 

[johnny utah]

yeah they can go jump

 

[TheFrood]

Well there you go. Letting your little head do all the thinking. Whenever I gave my GF gold , it was always a losing proposition. The new acid was a smart move. There will always be a discrepancy no matter what you do unless it is melted. Best you find someone else.

I recently sold a big 14k chain to my XRF guy. When it was melted , he said it was 12.8 kt. Not much you think , but in the volume it was a good chunk of change. He ate that one. So now , he wants to cut into everything to use his machine. Especially rings and thick chains which are now totally destroyed. Before I sell them ! I've seen the results and I can see his point. But now I think I gotta look elsewhere. If it's marked , 14k and it passes my 14k acid test , I want 14k prices. I try to get 85-90% of spot. Most don't want to pay this. Now if my XRF guy can't destroy my jewelry , pre-sale , he low balls me. Saying " the machine is not exactly accurate if I don't do this." It's all a scam to me , getting way too technical.

I'm now thinking of going back to hoarding and maybe getting a table top smelter and pouring my own. Take up another little hobby.

I've seen some really really cool videos on YouTube about refining and smelting jewelry into it's component metals. The chemistry is really fascinating on how it was done.

The one I watched was done by NileRed I think... He broke the jewelry down into it's valuable metal components over a few videos.

 

[KOB]

Even being paid a check can be traced. Cash is king. I don't care for the IRS thing. But if Hunter can write off hookers as a business expense , so should we.

 

[TheFrood]

Even being paid a check can be traced. Cash is king. I don't care for the IRS thing. But if Hunter can write off hookers as a business expense , so should we.

There we go. When I'm living as a nomad in a van, my side-business will be "generic detecting services"... Write off my gas, mileage, campground fees, etc, since I have to pay to travel from beach to beach to go fishing and metal detecting. Then deduct living expenses from what I find... I think I may wind up operating at a loss for years and years...

 

[KOB]

There we go. When I'm living as a nomad in a van, my side-business will be "generic detecting services"... Write off my gas, mileage, campground fees, etc, since I have to pay to travel from beach to beach to go fishing and metal detecting. Then deduct living expenses from what I find... I think I may wind up operating at a loss for years and years...

That's the van life ! And each year Sippy Cup Joe will be paying you a big check to do it !

 

[metaladdict]

Gave the GF some gold to send in, want to see if we could figure out how they work, little disappointed in the return.
I got pictures of all, weight of each ring, total weight, fineness marks(K), acid tested of each ring, magnet test, and record of the gold price at 10am, 11am, 12am.

Gold opened Thursday the 19th at 1947.00 and by end of day price was 1972.00, they Paid 1948.00 ..which I figure falls into the timeline they processed the package.

My scales total weight was 32.83 grams...their weight was 1.05 Troy ounces.. which is right on.

This is where we differed and New acid was ordered / used.
My Gold fineness, acid tested and marked... (5) 10k rings 27.02 grams and (1) 14k ring 5.79 grams
Theirs total 0.38 troy ounces = 10.77 24k gold -------- which equals out to 9k gold on each ring.

I figured 10k for all would be $859.00 minus 5% $42.95 equals $816.05
The check was for $703.00

At one time I thought they were buying the gold out right and paying 12k for all under 3 ounces, I was wrong.
All I can figure is they are using a Handheld XRF Gold Analyzer to get the purity of each piece of gold, than totaling. Or one of the rings was not real? Which I doubt since I rubbed them hard and test each twice. And I remember someone here posting most gold rings are not what they are stamped and can be a little less...........and since none of the 6 were marked with a (P) Plumb.

Last year I did the same, gave the GF a batch to send in.. it came back 10% (15%) under what I had estimated, this time it was 13% (18%) and this is figuring in there 5% fee. Will I use MidWest again.. ?

I don't feel cheated for I see they are there to make money and if I am right on the Analyzer gun the check was fair. But I am going to start looking around for a better source locally. If I can get 90% of what the gold is marked (K) I see me going that way.

Fineness marked,....(5) 10k rings 27.02 grams and (1) 14k ring 5.79 grams
View attachment 586334


Total weight 32.83 grams........1.05 troy ounces....................................................................New Acid Kit

View attachment 586335View attachment 586336

Acid test ........all passed as marked
View attachment 586337View attachment 586338

View attachment 586339

Let us know if you find a better refiner please.