funny story of fellow asking:

Tom_in_CA

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There was a fellow putting a thread on a forum, seeking advice for a dilema he'd run into. The story the fellow told went like this:

He'd gotten into the hobby of detecting, and figured he'd start off at the local park. However, reading forums, he figured that it was his duty to ask permission [perhaps interpretting the code of ethics to say that} So the fellow goes into city hall in his city, and approaches the front desk.

He asks the clerk there "Is it ok to metal detect in the parks?" The clerk looks at him in a confused manner, and doesn't know the answer. But since it involves "parks", she sends him down to another office down the hall, that houses the park's dept. So he approaches that desk next.

He asks that clerk: "Is it ok to metal detect in the parks?" She too is baffled by his question. She has to ask him to repeat. Then ask what he means and what it involves. So the man gleefully explains how his detector beeps over metals, and finds trinkets, coins, etc... and is just a fun innocent hobby. So the clerk looks to-&-fro over her literature, scans the parks rules book/sheet, and eventually says to the man: "I don't see why not"

With that the man happily replies: "great! And I'll be sure to cover all my holes". (guess he thought he was a real winner with that line, eh?). But the minute the lady heard the word "holes", she stopped the man. She says "hold on, let me go check something".

She excused herself from the front counter. The man could see her go back down the hallways behind the counter, poking her head in various other superiors office doorways, apparently confering with other senior staff. She returns to the front desk, and tells the man "sorry sir, but we're going to have to tell you no".

The man was bummed, and rather curious what had just happened to turn his "yes" to a "no". So he asked the gal "why?". The lady then handed him a pamphlet from the local underground utility co, titled: "Call before you dig". And the picture on the cover of this leaflet showed a back-hoe. The man immediately realized that this rule about calling an 800# before you dig was for sewers, gas lines, etc... And meant for heavy equipment digging, NOT metal detectorists.

So he handed the pamphlet back to the lady chuckling, and correcting her, and saying: "but that's talking about heavy equipment for deep excavations. I'm only going to be digging 6 inches deep, not 6 foot!".

The lady takes the pamphlet back from the man and flips through it. She hands it back to the man again and says: " but sir, it doesn't say *how* deep, it just says call before you dig, so we're still going to have to tell you no".

The poor guy left with the pamphlet, more confused now, than when he'd arrived.

True Story!
 
Having worked for PG&E, I am very familiar with those "Call Before You Dig" recommendations! :D
 
Ah

Hey Ron, then as a former PG&E utility worker, then shed light on this please for us:

Those advisories (aimed at heavy equipment workers, developers, etc...) don't, in fact, tell you "how deep" their admonition is for. Right? I mean, common sense logic dictates you're NOT going to reach a sewer pipe or gas line while detecting. And even if you did glance off of it with your leshe or probe, you're not going to hurt it.

However, when this subject came up before on another forum, someone pointed out that there are, in fact, high-speed cables (or some such telephone line or something) that can, in fact, be at only a foot (or possibly less?). And the damage that can be done by accidentally cutting those fiber-optics is VERY expensive.

But, I mean, sheesk, let's be reasonable here: NO ONE is going to go "calling PG&E locator-line-800# before he digs each pulltab, for permission. Right? Neither was the pamphlets ever meant to address the lady who digs a divot to plant carrots in her garden. Right? HOWEVER, given enough morphing, and asking enough of the "right people", you might indeed be told you can't dig w/o consulting those 800 #'s, right?
 
Nice story, just goes to show you shouldn't say "dig" or "holes" when asking for permission. :yes:

Hey, Isaac, yes, it's commonly advised to leave out any mention of "holes" or "dig", when asking permission to detect. Just use the euphamism "metal detect". Right?

HOWEVER (just to be the devil's advocate here): wouldn't leaving out mention of those words be .... uh ... "less than forthcoming" ? Wouldn't that be "mincing words"? I mean if you fail to mention the true nature and ramifications, what's to stop this from happening:

Someone comes out to gripe and tries to boot you. You proudly whip out your "permission". The person gets on their cell-phone, calls that "permission giver" and says "but he's digging and tearing the place up!". Upon which you are SOUNDLY scolded for getting permission under false pretenses, and promptly tossed out on your b*tt.

So, gee, I guess we need to go in and ask this way: "hi, can I dig, deface and alter the park please?" Lest we fail to alert them to the full implications of our question. Right? haha
 
There are minimum depths utilities adhere to and most are at least 18".

It is really all about common sense...Check for signs, don't go over locked gates, go at early hours or later in the day, try not to draw attention to yourself and of course leave the area better than when you arrived!
 
Actually, the run around is pretty common. I was told to go to the Police station first since so many Cops prospect (Sluice and pan) and some MD also. They would know policies. I went there and though they do Prospect and MD, no one knew anything really. I was told to go to city hall 1st floor. I did and the lady at the desk said go to 2nd floor such and such office. There the young woman left and went door to door asking if there was info. on what I needed. I was told to go to the 3rd floor and such and such office had a pamphlet explaining everything I wanted to know. So I go to the 3rd floor and the right office where I was told, No...... that is down the hall around the corner at so and so's office. (Thank God the building was only 3 floors tall). There I received a small two page pamphlet explaining where and how I could dig, prospect, pan and MD. After reading this I realized it was the most VAGUE thing I ever read. I went back to the City Hall and asked for this to be explained in layman's terms so I don't get arrested, fined or have my tools and MD taken away. Calls were made, I was redirected here and ther...... BUT no one knew any more then I did.
This is exactly true how my time was wasted in a very professional manner. And from what I have read and been told by others, this is the norm all over the states. UGH!
 
...It is really all about common sense...

Are you suggesting that the fellow in the story should have used common sense, rather than leaving it up to someone else's arbitrary whims and potential mis-conceptions ? And to have used common sense instead ?
 
Wouldn't happen to have a link to the original post, must be something recent since we've been discussing this over a month now...

Ever consider that all those 'no dig' rules, and 'don't remove objects' rules, are something we inherited from the early hunters from the 60s and 70s, when metal detecting equipment first became affordable, and easily available to the average income earners? No rules, no restrictions, and plenty of treasure to dig up. People weren't all that concerned about the environment, or safety. I'm sure there were plenty of dope smoking hippies, who found it much easier than panhandling for grass money. The no dig rule could simple encourage folks to go talk to the 'man' first, so he can give specific instruction on where and how he expects them to hunt on his site? It would address the problem, without completely banning the activity.

I wasn't old enough, 40-50 years ago, to really know what kind of mess people made for us. Only know about the hippies, from comments my father use to frequently make. I just know we have been steadily losing ground ever since, by dodging the law, side-stepping the rules. We will continue to be further restricted, unless we can work inside of the rules, and work to change them in our favor, not continue as most have in the past. Rules change all the time, and usually not for the good.
 
Wouldn't happen to have a link to the original post, must be something recent since we've been discussing this over a month now...

Ever consider that all those 'no dig' rules, and 'don't remove objects' rules, are something we inherited from the early hunters from the 60s and 70s, when metal detecting equipment first became affordable, and easily available to the average income earners? No rules, no restrictions, and plenty of treasure to dig up. People weren't all that concerned about the environment, or safety. I'm sure there were plenty of dope smoking hippies, who found it much easier than panhandling for grass money. The no dig rule could simple encourage folks to go talk to the 'man' first, so he can give specific instruction on where and how he expects them to hunt on his site? It would address the problem, without completely banning the activity.

I wasn't old enough, 40-50 years ago, to really know what kind of mess people made for us. Only know about the hippies, from comments my father use to frequently make. I just know we have been steadily losing ground ever since, by dodging the law, side-stepping the rules. We will continue to be further restricted, unless we can work inside of the rules, and work to change them in our favor, not continue as most have in the past. Rules change all the time, and usually not for the good.

Harvey, no, I don't have the original link. Why? Do you dis-believe that occurred?

As for the rest of what you're saying, it sounds like you think it was a GOOD thing that man went and asked? Lest he be "side-stepping the rules" Really ? C'mon now harvey, in that situation, where no one even knew what the heck it involved, and what applied to his question, then .... seriously now.... in THAT case can't you agree that the poor fellow probably could have just gone and been totally ignored ?

Or are you saying the fellow did the right thing, and is now obligated to un-tangle this web of silliness, object, appeal, get them to change their mind, etc? Can't you see that that's a clear cut case of no-one-caring TILL you asked?
 
Harvey, no, I don't have the original link. Why? Do you dis-believe that occurred?

As for the rest of what you're saying, it sounds like you think it was a GOOD thing that man went and asked? Lest he be "side-stepping the rules" Really ? C'mon now harvey, in that situation, where no one even knew what the heck it involved, and what applied to his question, then .... seriously now.... in THAT case can't you agree that the poor fellow probably could have just gone and been totally ignored ?

Or are you saying the fellow did the right thing, and is now obligated to un-tangle this web of silliness, object, appeal, get them to change their mind, etc? Can't you see that that's a clear cut case of no-one-caring TILL you asked?


This is a classic case of misunderstanding digging a 12 foot hole, the person said no you cant unless you call this number expecting you to dig 12 foot holes... you call that number and they just tell you where the lines are... sometimes you even have to do this to dig in your own property to get a locate...


In front of my house along the road there is a public atv trail and the atvs / trucks have exposed a main gas line... If there was a lot of lines in that area you wanted to detect i would call and ask if there were any lines in the area that are 12 or less inches above the ground. (i have found several lines like that which is why i dig carefuly, usually with a rock pick)
 
Haha, Tom I knew you could only contain yourself for so long! :lol: Another "shouldn't ask for permission" thread to go with the other 50.
 
There was a fellow putting a thread on a forum, seeking advice for a dilema he'd run into. The story the fellow told went like this:

He'd gotten into the hobby of detecting, and figured he'd start off at the local park. However, reading forums, he figured that it was his duty to ask permission [perhaps interpretting the code of ethics to say that} So the fellow goes into city hall in his city, and approaches the front desk.

He asks the clerk there "Is it ok to metal detect in the parks?" The clerk looks at him in a confused manner, and doesn't know the answer. But since it involves "parks", she sends him down to another office down the hall, that houses the park's dept. So he approaches that desk next.

He asks that clerk: "Is it ok to metal detect in the parks?" She too is baffled by his question. She has to ask him to repeat. Then ask what he means and what it involves. So the man gleefully explains how his detector beeps over metals, and finds trinkets, coins, etc... and is just a fun innocent hobby. So the clerk looks to-&-fro over her literature, scans the parks rules book/sheet, and eventually says to the man: "I don't see why not"

With that the man happily replies: "great! And I'll be sure to cover all my holes". (guess he thought he was a real winner with that line, eh?). But the minute the lady heard the word "holes", she stopped the man. She says "hold on, let me go check something".

She excused herself from the front counter. The man could see her go back down the hallways behind the counter, poking her head in various other superiors office doorways, apparently confering with other senior staff. She returns to the front desk, and tells the man "sorry sir, but we're going to have to tell you no".

The man was bummed, and rather curious what had just happened to turn his "yes" to a "no". So he asked the gal "why?". The lady then handed him a pamphlet from the local underground utility co, titled: "Call before you dig". And the picture on the cover of this leaflet showed a back-hoe. The man immediately realized that this rule about calling an 800# before you dig was for sewers, gas lines, etc... And meant for heavy equipment digging, NOT metal detectorists.

So he handed the pamphlet back to the lady chuckling, and correcting her, and saying: "but that's talking about heavy equipment for deep excavations. I'm only going to be digging 6 inches deep, not 6 foot!".

The lady takes the pamphlet back from the man and flips through it. She hands it back to the man again and says: " but sir, it doesn't say *how* deep, it just says call before you dig, so we're still going to have to tell you no".

The poor guy left with the pamphlet, more confused now, than when he'd arrived.

True Story!

Another great "story"....It's sooooo funny you know all the details of this md'ers conversation with said lady, her reactions etc. but no link, no mention of md'ers name, no mention of the website and my favorite part.......wait for it.........wait............coincidentally the one last thing he utters to the woman is his demise......oh the humanity. Are you going to tell me this md'er is you like you did in the last thread?
 
I would like to make a joint investment in a back-hoe if anyone is interested.
 
To the OP's story "Guys a prime example of the types i don't want around my neck of the woods"

People weren't all that concerned about the environment, or safety. I'm sure there were plenty of dope smoking hippies, who found it much easier than panhandling for grass money. Only know about the hippies, from comments my father use to frequently make. I just know we have been steadily losing ground ever since, by dodging the law, side-stepping the rules.

Hahaha:laughing: these 4 sentences put in a paragraph just made my day Thanks.
 
I would have just taken the pamphlet and said thank you ma'am, and would have called the 800 number , and just would'nt have detected around those little paint lines the marker left behind ,,,:lol:
 
Harvey, no, I don't have the original link. Why? Do you dis-believe that occurred?

As for the rest of what you're saying, it sounds like you think it was a GOOD thing that man went and asked? Lest he be "side-stepping the rules" Really ? C'mon now harvey, in that situation, where no one even knew what the heck it involved, and what applied to his question, then .... seriously now.... in THAT case can't you agree that the poor fellow probably could have just gone and been totally ignored ?

Or are you saying the fellow did the right thing, and is now obligated to un-tangle this web of silliness, object, appeal, get them to change their mind, etc? Can't you see that that's a clear cut case of no-one-caring TILL you asked?

Would be much of a scientific experiment, if we can;t verify and validate your data and facts. I'm not a huge fan of the science in the 'Climate Change'/'Global Warming' field either.

Personally, going off site, downtown to office bound authorities on the subject would be my last resort. I'm just not that driven to need to hunt ever parcel of land. Way more places to go, then time to hunt, where I don't need to make such a trip to ask.

You don't ask, so you don't know how common you scenarios are actual true. Seems like more people that ask, get permission, or find out they need a permit, and get to hunt those sites, compared to those who get denied. Of course, more people are inclined to complain about negative experiences, then when things go as expected.
 
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