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Hard time getting any kind of permission

aviationgale

Elite Member
Joined
Nov 21, 2010
Messages
1,507
Location
East Tennessee
About 2 months ago I asked this woman of about 35 if I could detect her yard. House probably 1900 or so with barn and outbuildings. She said that the orgininal owner was going to buy it and that she thought that he probably would not like it. (So basicly "she" still owned it.)So I let it go. I go by there 2 days ago and see a "For Sale by Owner" so I call. It's this womans mother saying that she probably wouldn't want me too. She (the woman) has moved to Hawaii. What gets me is why didn't you just say NO and be done with it. Earlier this week another house owned by the cities sewer and water dept. I stop in ask whoever, he tells me to email him and he'll pass it along blah, blah, blah. I stop back, he's not in, I leave a message for him, NOTHING! Here in East TN. I believe is one hard place to get permission to hunt. So now I have to go curbing and back to a park. Very frustrating!! Rant over....
 
You obviously have No 'Game'! :laughing: Our Brother beephead Never gets a NO! He just bulls his way on into all sorts of yards! His posts are a great read about some of the antics he employs to gain permissions! Take a look and give it a try! He sure has a permission pattern that seems to work on just about anybody!

He finds a ton of silver and gold, so its worth a look to figure out how he does it.....
 
Maybe it's in how you're asking and/or where you're asking to hunt! I mean, everyone gets turned down sometimes, some people just don't want anyone on their places.

I don't even bother with clerks or low level government types on city owned but not public sites such as condemned private lots. In my little town I went to the city manager (highest full time dude in the city, mayor is part-time & useless for this) and just laid out what I do, and asked if he had any problem with me hunting these vacant lots since they're city owned. He didn't. He started to say he didn't want me hunting the city park, but I told him I had already been there, done that, and filled in holes other people had left open, so he said he couldn't really tell me not to, which I already knew... so I got what I needed as far as the "official" go-ahead for the vacant lots and we parted friends.

However, for permissions, I mostly target sites that are either vacant, old business sites, and places where there's no manicured yard to mess with. After I figure out who the owner is, I just either call or catch them out at the sites I want and chat with them.

Hey, how ya doing, this is who I am, metal detecting is a hobby for me, do you mind if I run my metal detector around out here, etc. No mention of holes, no mention of digging, just friendly-like asking... Works I'd say 90% of the time.

In three years I've had one tentative "wait and see" from a property that was and still is in a legal snafu (I still call him every spring to see if that has changed), and one owner who I couldn't really get to (his wife fielded his calls & obviously he either didn't want to call me back or she didn't want to pass along my number) but other than that, everyone else has been way accommodating.
 
You obviously have No 'Game'! :laughing: Our Brother beephead Never gets a NO! He just bulls his way on into all sorts of yards! His posts are a great read about some of the antics he employs to gain permissions! Take a look and give it a try! He sure has a permission pattern that seems to work on just about anybody!

He finds a ton of silver and gold, so its worth a look to figure out how he does it.....

I am well aware of how well he (Beephead) does, and seems as though he never gets a no. I don't if location is the problem, he lives in the Memphis area and I'm all the way on the other side of TN. Hill country, backwoods etc. Is it because he gives out those key chain flashlights? Who knows. I know I'm always polite dress nice etc. I'll keep plugging at it but it does get to you after awhile. I just want a few houses, I seem to do fairly well at those....
 
I wouldn't get too discouraged over a couple no's. Your going to have streaks where no one will work with you and then you'll have stretches where everything falls together with no issues. You'll have to find that sweet spot between coming off as a confident friendly trustworthy person and a Butt Kiss. Might sound bad but you have to almost sell yourself as someone they want on their property. I start simple with an introduction and if it feels like they're questioning it, turn up the sweet talk a little. Doesn't always work but definitely helps! Good luck
 
OP, don't take this wrong, but you gave ONE example of not getting permission, ONE. Have you had the same results 3 times, 50 times, 100 times?

"No" is just part of the deal. It could have just as easily been a "yes". Know you'll get turned-down, and know you'll be giver some permissions. If you can't take the rejections, you might want to consider only hunting areas where none is needed, as those you mentioned later in your post.

I look at it as part of the "game", in order to make better finds, most of the work comes in the form of research. It's easy to come on here, look at some of these killer finds, and think some of these folks just blindly stumble into these areas. Sure, it cold happen on occasion, but I'd venture to bet most of them "pay their dues" in hours upon hours of research before loading-up to go hunt a site.

Ask your friends, family, find a buddy and try and interest them in MDing, then sharing research and spots (as long as it's a 2-way street). You still have grandparents still alive and local? Talk to them, or make acquaintances with other older folks, I'm sure they'd enjoy reminiscing about old times and you might learn of a new spot or two to check out.

If you look at it as a "job", you're not going to enjoy yourself. If you accept research, time involved, and doing some leg-work as "just part of the hobby", you'll go farther, and enjoy yourself more because you'll put yourself in the position of asking permission on more spots. You'll get more "sure, go ahead" from 25 spots, than you will 5, but the same goes for the "no's". Play the odds, win some, lose some.Tell 'em "thanks anyway, nice to meet you and I appreciate your time", hand them a card with your name and number if you want, and tell them if they ever lose a piece of jewelry, keys, etc to give you a call, you'd be more than glad to help.

1st impressions mean a lot, from what you drive, to your personal appearance. Be sure to make a good 1st impression.

Good luck!
 
Yes I have had plenty of no's. And it is very frustrating. The reason I'm so disgruntled on these two particular sites is that NO ONE lives in either one of them. Totally empty. The woman I mentioned, I showed her my equipment to show her I wasn't using a shovel or "backhoe". The second one I finally got the standard answer about the "liability", so it was a no. I have no friends no family or even coworkers for that matter to ask anything about this place, and for the record being a "yankee" transplant doesn't help.....
 
Yes I have had plenty of no's. And it is very frustrating. The reason I'm so disgruntled on these two particular sites is that NO ONE lives in either one of them. Totally empty. The woman I mentioned, I showed her my equipment to show her I wasn't using a shovel or "backhoe". The second one I finally got the standard answer about the "liability", so it was a no. I have no friends no family or even coworkers for that matter to ask anything about this place, and for the record being a "yankee" transplant doesn't help.....

How many times have you got a yes vs a no?

Don't let it get you down, it sounds like you are. You come-off as being a generally unhappy person, maybe I'm wrong.

Keep telling yourself your luck will change, and it will. Perhaps you're subconsciously carrying a negative attitude when you speak to someone about permission. I'd be looking at my "approach" and see if there's a way I could improve on it. Jot down what you say, and re-read it, see if there's something that stands out to you. Just don't overthink it, you're just asking permission to detect, not marry their daughter :D

Sounds like you need to start making some friends. I'm in a very similar situation myself. I just got permission for 3 spots from a local farmer, as soon as they're done in the fields. This is after a recent move, and not detecting for a few years. Sure, I'm not having an easy time, but it's work at it or find another hobby.

How would you feel if you got permission to a spot you really had high hopes for, only to spend a day hunting and found nothing? Would you feel happy you got permission, or bummed you didn't dig a pot of silvers? Metal detecting is simply a hobby, to enjoy. If you aren't going to enjoy it, you either need to figure-out how, or reconsider it as something you actually want to it. It shouldn't be a source of aggravation.

Find yourself some old plat maps, find where some old houses sat in a field, and ask permission there. People are generally less concerned about a field than they are their yard (and having a stranger near their home). You have to try and see it from their side as well.

As I said before, it takes time and work to find places to hunt. That's why new people who go to the "find a hunting buddy" board and make their 1st post wanting to go hunt with someone who has spots to hunt, seldom get a reply. Someone else does all the work, so they have nothing invested in it.

Are you researching any spots to hunt? Or just driving around until you see a likely spot, like an old house? The internet is an amazing research tool, as it the local library.

Hang in there, you'll get better at things, and your luck will change, just have a little confidence i n yourself .
 
I'm with you aviationgale, I've tried to ask permission to detect a few old yards and got "no" every time.
Because of the rejection, I have gotten to be even worse at asking folks :(
Now I get tongue tied and awkward. I wasn't like this back when I used to ask girls on dates, I had much better luck and was way more confident.

I definitely have to come up with some different tactics.
 
Over the years, it seems that getting permission has become something of an art. I look for civil war artifacts so my getting permission could be different from someone coin hunting. But basically I want to approach the owner with as many facts as possible. I use GIS to find his name and the amount of land he owns. Than I try and find as much information as possible about the land because it is always helpful to tell them something about their land they didn't know. You can search previous owners in some counties. If possible I keep them talking for as long as possible. I want them to feel they just made a new friend and it is hard to tell a friend "NO". I use business cards and will carry a Minie ball with me to show them what I am looking for. I usually always take my maps to the door with me to show them. I usually spend more time talking than hunting the first time there. Nothing could be worse than to find a hot spot and be told you could only hunt one time. But friends can always come back. Good luck.
 
Getting more YES'es

aviationgale... and anyone else reading this who is interested in getting to a "YES" more often when it comes to asking permission...

Here is an interesting video, titled "The Science of Persuasion" that I ran across a couple of years ago, when I was checking the daily 5 videos at WIMP.COM. There used to be an APP for WIMP, but the videos are only available now on the net at www.wimp.com [family friendly videos]. When I first saw this and viewed it, I realized the concepts can be applied in all kinds of situations, but detectorists might surely benefit from watching this.

When I saw this thread, I immediately thought of this video, so I did a quick search at their web site and I'm sharing it below.

This will be almost a twelve minute investment of your time. Is that worth more YES'es ?

After a quick review of the first couple minutes, I can see that fellow Forum member, beephead has mastered the first concept... "Reciprocation"

I won't even charge a dime for sharing this one. I hope it will aid a few of us in upping our hit rate on seeking permission. Post your comments after viewing the video if you like. NOTE: The video has no sound during the first 12 seconds, so don't adjust your volume till the sound starts.

So here's the link: https://www.wimp.com/the-science-of-persuasion/

jimther
Librarian - Massachusetts Treasure Hunting Association
www.masstreasure.com
 
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I ask a lot of people and happily I get many more yeses than nos. Here are some suggestions.

First let me say that I was a lead sales trainer for AT&T for 32 years and asking permissions IS selling. You are selling yourself. Not metal detecting.

The first thing is have some business cards printed up. They give the impression that you are serious about this and it implies you are experienced, qualified, trained and legit. I have 500 printed at a time and they last me about a year. I carry them at all times and hand them out freely. I recently was dragged by the wife to a "couples baby shower" for her best friend's son. But I carried a minie ball I had just found and a dozen cards. Eventually the men were all in one room and I showed my find and handed out business cards and left with 2 permissions.

You see I'm a member of two local historical societies for 3 reasons. First, great presentations, second it's a great place to network (the members own places that I want to hunt) and third it looks impressive on my cards. I pay $50 a year in dues between the two groups and worth every penny.

Also you need a catchy introduction. Rehearse it over and over until you can give it flawlessly. It needs to be friendly, professional and informational all in 30 seconds or less. Then you need to anticipate objections and be prepared to handle them. As an example if you ask someone for permission and they ask what's in it for them or they demand all the finds, how would you respond? Plan for that.

If you are intimidated about asking someone start with baby steps. Ask your family, friends and neighbors. Soon you won't have an issue asking. Then the finds will really start coming in.
 

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Selling yourself? I worked 50+ years for a living until retiring, and WORK required that you fit in, sell yourself to the bosses, faking a lot. I wasn't a ladder-climber myself and lots of it was because it was BS and demeaning after a point. IMO, the best part of retiring was getting out of that game. Best part!

My point is that there a ranges of introverts and extroverts. There are ranges of physically attractive people and those less attractive. Metal detecting allows me to be more of "my real person", solitary days hiding in my headphones.

The neat thing about detecting is that it's self-pleasing,,,not being made to be someone else that I ain't, like actual working for a living can be.

I seldom ask for private permissions. I don't dress to sell myself to a stranger for a silver dime in their yard. As the old saying goes, "You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear" and I'm likely not going to start now after a working life of being made to exactly that.

I enjoy the folks I meet in the hunts, and feel I am very sociable in general. I stop and talk with anyone interested, even kids, which many tectors purposely avoid, but those times I have approached strangers to ask to hunt, haven't been very positive overall, and that includes some friends and even some family.

Face it, metal detecting means "digging" to strangers, no other way unless you just hunt tot lots and recreational sites for fresh drops with lots of foot traffic, so going up to Joe or Sally to dig in their yard is logically not going to be a talent for those of us mainly independent souls who simply want to just be ourselves.

Sorry for the rant, yet many of us similar to myself, simply won't do well with asking permission on privately owned homesteads.

Just how much is a silver coin worth, and the rejections, then the reinforced reality that most all of us detectors aren't ever going to be an ounce close to a Don Juan or Matthew McConaughey in any form or fashion?

When it comes to business cards? Lot of strangers only vision that guy on TV digging with a backhoe, and a card might even give extra pause.

Should nobody ever ask for private permissions? No. Definitely ask IF IT FEELS RIGHT AT THE TIME. Me, I ain't just gonna walk up to some total stranger's doorstep of an old Victorian style house on the older part of town, and try to sell myself as someone different.

I suspect that some here reading this will say to me, "I'm happy you aren't, as I am also happy when a newbie quits early in the hobby. That just leaves more for me."

Is that really good PR to MDing when someone starting or thinking about starting
or who is thinking about quitting, hears that? no.

I detect for "me." I'll sell myself in permissions, just as myself. I won't get the great permissions unless lucky, and I suspect many others like I, won't either.

I am retired from forced, self presentation. Not going to remodel "me" for a silver dime now. I'd done lots more of that in the workplace over 50 years, which woulda paid far more $$$ rewards than about any treasure find in someone's private yard.

Just weigh the value to yourself, of yourself.
 
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