Food for thought

[VBDave]

The majority of us are middle age and older, and this whole computer thing is still new (and amazing)to us. It is nice to be able to live vicariously through another hunter's success when you can't get out yourself. But many of us really don't appreciate the power of the information that can be gleaned from the internet in the way that young professionals do. As a retired cop, I've seen my share of good natured internet banter used against innocent defendants, both criminally and administratively, by mean spirited humans who don't deserve their positions of authority. Young professionals. Cops, lawyers, judges, politicians, activists, scam artists. Cyber mining for information valuable to their pursuit is now second nature to all. There WILL come a time when forum information is used to prosecute one of us unfairly, or to close areas to hunting.

The internet is open for inspection by the general public. Our hobby is misunderstood by most and viewed as next to larceny by many. We can't even reach a general consensus amongst ourselves , as witnessed by the recent 10 page debate over the UVA honker. In that debate, there were even a few close brushes with offense and anger between some of us. We good naturedly call each other "pirates" and "looters" and put it in print for the world to see. WE know we're doing nothing legally or morally wrong. But we need to be cognizant of the fact that this is not a private conversation, and we have no control over who eavesdrops, nor how they use what we say against us.

Feel free to dismiss this line of reasoning as the musings of an old cop harboring a siege mentality. I promise I won't say I told you so.

[sectshun8]

Members who have been here for about 3 years should know exactly what you're talking about... no reason to bring all that drama back up.

But it is very good advice... keep all those identifiable goodies a secret, or some folks () will make it their business to ruin your day.

[gemmy1]

Sound advice indeed.

[dewcon]

Dave ive always said the same thing.... because as to what you say about people leaving their trash or holes, as well as some of the relics posts. They are here and will always be here for review. When we complain about ourselves its just more fuel for shutting down our regular hunting areas. As some one put it..... the people in charge find it much simpler to put a sign out saying no detecting as to come to our defense based on one simple complaint. With more in the hobby we have more visibility. As a former Asst. Magistrate i hear you about the laws. Some states even now have laws on the book of theft of LOST PROPERTY. I had an incident a few days back where a guy said if you find a diamond earring in this area let me know my wife lost it. He was serious. Went a bit farther down and a couple called me over and said that guys wife didnt loose it.... there was another couple having a tiff about her loosing one and why did she wear it. There is always someone trying to take advantage.

Dew

[Cfmct]

What is the point? shut down the forums? stop posting anything but corroded zinc pennies? this is a hobby and we are sharing our hobby with ourselves and others... I'm sure you aren't the first one to post something like this and won't be the last..

[CanSlaw]

Dave, I have to agree with your thoughts. The term "Pirate" has come about on the forums a few years ago. Being an old hunter I never cared much for the term that a web surfer may see and think all detectorist on the beaches are "thieves". I use to "play pirates" when I was a kid, but when I hunt the beaches, I am as serious as I can be.

Just an old hunters opinion.

[Cfmct]

Originally Posted by CanSlaw

Dave, I have to agree with your thoughts. The term "Pirate" has come about on the forums a few years ago. Being an old hunter I never cared much for the term that a web surfer may see and think all detectorist on the beaches are "thieves". I use to "play pirates" when I was a kid, but when I hunt the beaches, I am as serious as I can be.

Just an old hunters opinion.

I never played pirate as a kid so I guess I am now

[MikeSatter]

I totally agree with placing information on the Internet and it being so public if you have any doubts goggle your name or screen name.

[VBDave]

Originally Posted by Cfmct-PI

What is the point? shut down the forums? stop posting anything but corroded zinc pennies? this is a hobby and we are sharing our hobby with ourselves and others... I'm sure you aren't the first one to post something like this and won't be the last..

If we think we should just shut it down because we no longer "show and tell", then we must admit that "show and tell" has become the most important aspect of the forum. I have much more interest in learning my craft through the intelligent discussion of equipment and technique than I do "show and tell". AND... discussion of equipment and technique is unique to the hobby and of no interest to those who would misjudge our motives. Because it gives them no ammunition. IMHO.

[CanSlaw]

Originally Posted by Cfmct-PI

I never played pirate as a kid so I guess I am now

You missed a lot growing up.

[Bigpoppa]

Dave, I very much enjoy reading your posts as they do show years of expierience and wisdom...Your responses to the Excal PP thread are the most enjoyable and I just haven't had the energy to respond to all of the topics in that thread..So I'll start here

In regards to the internet, well yes these scenarios could happen, but are unlikely..
I could just as easily be run over by a crazy drunk neighbor as being prosecuted from a find being posted on the internet..
I never knew of these forums until 5 weeks ago, but found it incredible to see finds from all over the world and be able to trade info with other hunters..This forum saved me a ton of $$$ on my detector purchase and hours of research and gas $$$ ..
I have heard from numerous people "Why did you post pics of those gold coins, guys will come from all over ?"...WHY, because I want to share my joy with other hunters and give them hope..Especially someone who just bought their first machine last week..I wish I could turn back time and show pics of my findings from the 70's and 80's as new hunters would be blown away..
Whats the point of finding something cool if you can't share it with someone who appreciates it ?? Your wife or girlfriend probably doesn't care that much..Kids probably not...Friends and family also probably not..They'll all listen, but in reality you don't see their enthusiasm and they aren't going to beg you to borrow your extra detector for tomorrows hunt..

Bottom line is I don't hink we need to be paranoid about posting our finds..
If the item is so questionable as in an easily identifiable class ring, well then maybe that should be kept close to the vest..However if you think you shouldn't be posting a pic, then maybe you already know that you should be trying to find it's owner..It's all what we believe inside is our moral responsibility...

I'm sure the closing of some affluent or smaller beaches to detectorists is a possibility at some point due to ALL OF THE RULES CONSTANTLY BEING ADDED TO BEACH SIGNS..
Luckily for me I mostly hunt Atlantic City, Dirty Jersey and the city officials have to deal with other problems such as Murder, Armed Robbery, Crack, Heroin, Prostitution, Homeless, Poverty, Depressed Economy etc.. etc...
I think metal detecting is pretty far down their list of eyesores...

In regards to the public's perception of the hobby, well I'm not sure it is as negative as some may believe..I do feel bad for most dirt diggers as I obviously see a huge change overall in the hobby since returning in regard to rules and restrictions..
At the beach everyone is very friendly..In the month since returning I have been stopped by all sorts of diff people..
If we all could take a few mins once in awhile and take the headphones off and chat about our hobby to the public then maybe our appearance wouldn't be so negative...Everyone that walks away from me is pretty jovial and I'm sure some are thinking about buying a detector..
This Asian guy the other day with his family was priceless...I dug three coins in front of him and his smile and excitement were infectious...

The internet is is constantly changing the way the world operates and we just have to jump on the train or be content sitting alone in the corner of our rooms fondling our gold finds for the year

I don't care how much any of us find, cause it doesn't mean swquaddush if you can't enjoy it with someone...

[sectshun8]

Originally Posted by Bigpoppa

Bottom line is I don't hink we need to be paranoid about posting our finds..

Said from someone who really doesn't know... sadly enough. We've had members called out and threatened with legal action for their finds. Won't name names, but seeing as how this thread was started by a member of law enforcement, maybe you can make your own conclusions.

Should we need to be paranoid? Absoutely not... might it be wise to be at least a little bit? You betcha Just like those busy bodies who call the cops for that suspicious man with MD not doing anything wrong, they just don't like it... or people with no authority whatsoever telling you that you can be swinging in a certain place... there are folks, as VBDave points out that look on the forums in search of using your posts against you.

[Cfmct]

Originally Posted by VBDave

If we think we should just shut it down because we no longer "show and tell", then we must admit that "show and tell" has become the most important aspect of the forum. I have much more interest in learning my craft through the intelligent discussion of equipment and technique than I do "show and tell". AND... discussion of equipment and technique is unique to the hobby and of no interest to those who would misjudge our motives. Because it gives them no ammunition. IMHO.

This forum was started to help others with infomation and that is our main goal here...

"show and tell" is a part of the forum thoughas a matter of fact on all the forums.. as it is in other hobbies besides metal detecting, we are not unique... who are we to tell others they can't share their finds with others?


I for one won't try and stop members from showing their finds... I will share in their happiness as well.... and I will post mine as well...

[Cfmct]

Originally Posted by sectshun8

Said from someone who really doesn't know... sadly enough. We've had members called out and threatened with legal action for their finds. Won't name names, but seeing as how this thread was started by a member of law enforcement, maybe you can make your own conclusions.

Should we need to be paranoid? Absoutely not... might it be wise to be at least a little bit? You betcha Just like those busy bodies who call the cops for that suspicious man with MD not doing anything wrong, they just don't like it... or people with no authority whatsoever telling you that you can be swinging in a certain place... there are folks, as VBDave points out that look on the forums in search of using your posts against you.

Good post Jimmy...

[Bigpoppa]

Originally Posted by sectshun8

Said from someone who really doesn't know... sadly enough..

I find it sad that this is all you came away with from my entire lengthy post




Yes these things COULD happen, but they are UNLIKELY !!!!!


Thousands and thousands and thousands of finds have been posted on multiple forums...
How many of these finds have reached the stage of prosecution or legal action ???

It's just plain silly to worry about this kind of thing...

I'm more worried that some lunatic will go on a shooting rampage in my kids school, which is more probable.


If something is so valuable and identifiable that you don't want the world to see, well then keep it that way...

[Cfmct]

Originally Posted by Bigpoppa

Dave, I very much enjoy reading your posts as they do show years of expierience and wisdom...Your responses to the Excal PP thread are the most enjoyable and I just haven't had the energy to respond to all of the topics in that thread..So I'll start here

In regards to the internet, well yes these scenarios could happen, but are unlikely..
I could just as easily be run over by a crazy drunk neighbor as being prosecuted from a find being posted on the internet..
I never knew of these forums until 5 weeks ago, but found it incredible to see finds from all over the world and be able to trade info with other hunters..This forum saved me a ton of $$$ on my detector purchase and hours of research and gas $$$ ..
I have heard from numerous people "Why did you post pics of those gold coins, guys will come from all over ?"...WHY, because I want to share my joy with other hunters and give them hope..Especially someone who just bought their first machine last week..I wish I could turn back time and show pics of my findings from the 70's and 80's as new hunters would be blown away..
Whats the point of finding something cool if you can't share it with someone who appreciates it ?? Your wife or girlfriend probably doesn't care that much..Kids probably not...Friends and family also probably not..They'll all listen, but in reality you don't see their enthusiasm and they aren't going to beg you to borrow your extra detector for tomorrows hunt..

Bottom line is I don't hink we need to be paranoid about posting our finds..
If the item is so questionable as in an easily identifiable class ring, well then maybe that should be kept close to the vest..However if you think you shouldn't be posting a pic, then maybe you already know that you should be trying to find it's owner..It's all what we believe inside is our moral responsibility...

I'm sure the closing of some affluent or smaller beaches to detectorists is a possibility at some point due to ALL OF THE RULES CONSTANTLY BEING ADDED TO BEACH SIGNS..
Luckily for me I mostly hunt Atlantic City, Dirty Jersey and the city officials have to deal with other problems such as Murder, Armed Robbery, Crack, Heroin, Prostitution, Homeless, Poverty, Depressed Economy etc.. etc...
I think metal detecting is pretty far down their list of eyesores...

In regards to the public's perception of the hobby, well I'm not sure it is as negative as some may believe..I do feel bad for most dirt diggers as I obviously see a huge change overall in the hobby since returning in regard to rules and restrictions..
At the beach everyone is very friendly..In the month since returning I have been stopped by all sorts of diff people..
If we all could take a few mins once in awhile and take the headphones off and chat about our hobby to the public then maybe our appearance wouldn't be so negative...Everyone that walks away from me is pretty jovial and I'm sure some are thinking about buying a detector..
This Asian guy the other day with his family was priceless...I dug three coins in front of him and his smile and excitement were infectious...

The internet is is constantly changing the way the world operates and we just have to jump on the train or be content sitting alone in the corner of our rooms fondling our gold finds for the year

I don't care how much any of us find, cause it doesn't mean swquaddush if you can't enjoy it with someone...

Good honest post Big...

[sectshun8]

Originally Posted by Bigpoppa

I find it sad that this is all you came away with from my entire lengthy post

Don't assume it's all I came away with... however it's the part I decided to focus on for my reply. I agree whole heartedly at the unlikely possibility that anyone's posts could or would be used against them legally... however, it happens, AND HAS HAPPENED on this forum.

Same team man, same team.

[MikeSatter]

I believe in going by the MD Code of Ethics and helping one another on this forum, but I will not reveal the location of my finds to anyone unless we are hunting together.

[imalookin2]

I would never worry about what law enforcement is watching. Especially when a reference to that honker UVA ring. UVA is in Charlottesville Va. The ring was a VMI ring, VMI is in Lexington Va. If the cops can't even figure out what city it was from they are nothing for me to fear. Sorry Law Enforcement, get your facts right! Just kidding, no offense, please don't shoot.

[goodmore]

I don't show my finds. I never will. But I really don't care if someone else does. To tell the truth I like looking at them. But some of the threads do rub me a little bit. I think it senseless to give a running tally of your finds with every post. For example 50th and 51st gold rings for the year. That sort of ticks me off a little bit. For one the regulars know you are good at detecting and you have been hitting it good. The only reason I see this kind of post being made is to brag and say hey don't forget how good I am.

I use the forums to discuss equipment and technique. I am in a great hobby that I enjoy talking about. Take it from me. The people at work roll their eyes when I start getting technical on them. I am glad to have the forums and dare I say friends to ask questions about this great hobby.