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  #41  
Old 09-02-2017, 08:45 AM
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  #42  
Old 09-02-2017, 10:09 AM
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Ole Captain Save A Detectorist is still at it, eh?


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  #43  
Old 09-02-2017, 10:19 AM
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The f70 /Patriot is very fast on recovery speed but like you saw just slow down the swing
speed and you can find things, I do.
I am prob missing some stuff but thats why we own more than one detector.
I wish I kept my F70 it was a different animal.
However I will never sell my Atp its too cool! Happy hunting.

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  #44  
Old 09-02-2017, 10:29 AM
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There are also videos showing missed targets by F70/75 that the Deus picks out but I don't have that kinda cash. The Rutus alter 71 is good along with the Ctx 3030 and E Trac.

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  #45  
Old 09-02-2017, 11:32 AM
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I am the owner of an F70 and the AtPro...I feel compelled to contribute some thoughts to this drunken campfire comparison brawl and 'whip mine out' metaphorically for all and sundry to contemplate and stand in awe of.....

OP's Initial thesis has validity (AtPro vs Pat for general dirt work) and merited further discussion/comparison.... Video documentation to support thesis.. As an end user of both machines, I would agree 100% with the OP's scientific based research and ultimate obvious conclusion!

One thing of particular note during the Air test phase is the band of Proportional Audio...With the F70/Patriots range of settings, (Sens+thresh+DP tones) a user can indeed maximize this important feature...He may balance the search depth to a particular location quite effectively Which allows for some rapid Audio Primary hunting... IE: Heres a Q at 3"....Heres a D at 7"...Heres a Nickel in the roots, etc...

Yes indeed, the tone crispness and speed and many other features of the Patriot certainly outshine the Pro for general purpose dirt work...

I take the batts out of the Pro at 10-12hrs, when they begin to fade on account of the Pro does NOT perform well with half deads!...I then pop them straight into the F70 for another 15+ hrs of solid hunting...The F70/Pat will go strong to the very end of batt life and run on fumes)

This team of the Pro and the Patriot will certainly cover a multitude of hunting situations, and deserves a bit of contemplative thought when building a stable of tools. (SWOT/ROI analysis)...They are 'Brothers of different Mothers'...and as such, theres always a smart light fast one and a dumb fat slow one! But hey, somebodies gotta lower the deck umbrella in the rain sometimes....

....As Judge Smails remarked: "The World needs ditch diggers too"...The absolute perfect rig would be a waterproof Patriot...But thats like asking Santa for 'The Perfect Kid'...Fast, Light, Smart, and will go outside and mow the yard in the rain!! ...

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  #46  
Old 09-02-2017, 02:08 PM
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as a beach guy the test is meaningless to me i would of heard two possible gold rings then a possible silver ring how could you possibly miss that whats the mystery
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  #47  
Old 09-02-2017, 05:53 PM
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waterproof is always a benefit for those early hunts when the grass is all wet. I use my F5 in the morning with the orange garrett pointer and have to be careful of setting down the detector in the grass. I have an atp but I switch back and forth. Plus, sudden rainstorm it's nice to have the detector be waterproof. All of them should be waterproof and have the ability to charge the batteries through solar power.
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  #48  
Old 09-02-2017, 08:46 PM
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Watching this video carefully I find some flaws in the reasoning here. The test with the coin between the nails.....they would have you believe that this is a common scenerio often experienced out in the field.....wrong. That test was used because they knew the pro would not do well......but you will NOT ....ever have those three items together and placed exactly that way out in the real world. That did show a particular strength in the other detector , but the fact that they were able to find a way to artificially create a situation where the pro would fail.....one that you will never encounter in real life.....does not show a weakness in the pro. Fact is , no matter what detector you are using you CAN find a way to set those items up for the detector to fail. Same thing goes for the recovery test , which DID show a particular strength in the other detector as well ,.....but thats not a real world situation either , and its not surprising that he found another target configuration where the pro didnt do so well....but if you can find that exact arrangement out in the wild I will give you a million dollars Fact is , if you set either of these tests up the way you actually might encounter them in the wild , I am confident both detectors would do equally well and you may even find an arrangement where the pro outshines the patriot. If you set up anything to fail in an artificial environment , it will. And if you set up an environment where one particular detector outshines another , no matter which ones they are , it will. This guy sells the patriot detector , dont think he is incapable of staging a late night infomercial style sales pitch , or that he couldnt have set up the tests differently to show the strengths of the pro and make it perform better than the patriot if he wanted to. But even then it wouldnt match what you will experience out in the wild , so it would be just as pointless.

As technical as these tests appear , they are misleading.....and intentionally so.

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  #49  
Old 09-02-2017, 09:23 PM
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You must not hunt in much iron or trash. The test show the way the machines handle objects close to iron and modern trash or low conducters with a high conducter close to them. I love all these people who say well it will magically do better in a real life situation... well coins laying in thick iron is a real life scenario where I hunt. How do you think metal detecting companies test their detectors to see what there capable of Have you ever watched the whites mx sport video where there at whites test facility testing the machines abilitys? Check it out. How do you think garrett test their machine before they go to the field to test them that's right you guessed it in set up test senarios. Maybe someone needs to call them and tell them these test have no validity on how they will perform in the field in iron or modern trash. Show me a test that you can setup to make the pro outshine the patriot outside of water hunting... You guys crack me up throwing off on test that shows a detectors weakness. Love the those test don't me anything , some know better than that. If it wont pass it in the garden it shouldn't make it into the field in my book but hey to each his own.

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  #50  
Old 09-02-2017, 09:33 PM
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I usually hunt in iron that most couldn't imagine, and maybe skip over on purpose.. I've pulled a lot of gold out of iron laden sections of water that have been well covered by CTXs, and Excals.. But I'm positive the Excal and CTX get more depth on cleaner ground. A deus would drown...

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  #51  
Old 09-02-2017, 09:38 PM
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It takes a skilled hunter to hunt in that type of iron my hats off to ya. I find most of my good find s there. in iron that is.

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  #52  
Old 09-02-2017, 10:27 PM
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Originally Posted by calabash digger View post
You must not hunt in much iron or trash. The test show the way the machines handle objects close to iron and modern trash or low conducters with a high conducter close to them. I love all these people who say well it will magically do better in a real life situation... well coins laying in thick iron is a real life scenario where I hunt. How do you think metal detecting companies test their detectors to see what there capable of Have you ever watched the whites mx sport video where there at whites test facility testing the machines abilitys? Check it out. How do you think garrett test their machine before they go to the field to test them that's right you guessed it in set up test senarios. Maybe someone needs to call them and tell them these test have no validity on how they will perform in the field in iron or modern trash. Show me a test that you can setup to make the pro outshine the patriot outside of water hunting... You guys crack me up throwing off on test that shows a detectors weakness. Love the those test don't me anything , some know better than that. If it wont pass it in the garden it shouldn't make it into the field in my book but hey to each his own.

I hunt in MEGA iron and trash.

The test shows how these two detectors handle this PARTICULAR configuration only , with each target exactly spaced in relation to each other....which is something you are never going to find in the wild. Take that same test and turn the nails in a slightly different direction , it don't take much at all....just a little nudge , and it equals a HUGE alteration to the scenario. Just moving one of those nails a hair can make a world of difference....and in the wild they wont be set up anything like the test anyway and the slightest difference can make a world of difference. No offense intended , but you are trying so hard to be right that you are missing the point. Even in this particular configuration the pro DID hit on the coin , it just didn't sound that great.....still it was right there, so close. Move any of those objects just a bit and it would bang out loud and clear....and that's more what you would see in the field no matter how trashy it is. Stagger those targets more , toss them out on the ground , now put them at different levels.....now that's getting atleast a little closer to what you would see in the real world. But still not quite the same. This salesman found a way to make you think he was illustrating a weakness when all he really did was show there are possible configurations that can fool any detector. Assemble the targets a little different and some other detector can have trouble with it. When you control the experiment , you control the outcome ....it really is that simple , you are missing the point. This " test " illustrates one VERY specific configuration out of like billions or trillions possible , not counting environmental effects and variables. And this specific configuration is known to be very difficult , so it is commonly used to show detector STRENGTHS , not weaknesses ( the pro actually did quite well with it ).....since you are never going to run into this exact thing in the field. Ive been at this over 25 years.....I haven't seen it all but I have seen a lot

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  #53  
Old 09-02-2017, 11:37 PM
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These are my test garden..

Both 14K gold, and picked out of iron..

Air tested them next to a tiger shark.. The heart had to be touching the coil on the TS, 4 inches on the ATP..

TS couldn't see the chain, ATP, about 1.5 inches..

Will the Deus do that or Patriot?

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  #54  
Old 09-02-2017, 11:55 PM
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Default AT Pro vs The World

Having owned both, here's the way I see it. ----- (IMHO)---- The AT machines are good mid level machines, easy to operate, rugged, and waterproof. They are not the Ferrari's of detectors, more like a Chevy Impala. ---- Dependable, and easy to drive. --- Most detectorist, (especially those with less experience), will find more coins, and have more fun with the AT machines, vs the 'hi-tech' machines, such as the E-Trac, or Deus. ------ While the E-Trac, Deus, and other such machines may be a 'better' detector when it comes to depth, and recovery speed, I don't feel that they are quantitatively a 'better' machine. ---- A Deus in the hands of an experienced Deus user, will smoke a AT machine, but the AT machines, in the hand of your 'average' user, will smoke the Deus. ---- Not trying to stir the pot, just offering my opinion, which I think is objective, and fair. ---- I sold my Deus, and I sold my AT machine. ----Am happy with my T2, Makro Racer2, Nokta Relic., and 705. All serve a different purpose for me, and all have things I like, and things I dislike, about them. ----Peace to all, ..............
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  #55  
Old 09-03-2017, 12:37 AM
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Some more on these " tests ".....even something like the nail board test ( and others ) mostly illustrates the strengths of a remarkable detector , not necessarily the weakness of another , because its designed to be tough though you will not encounter that " exact " configuration in the wild....even in the worst cases what you will actually see is something very different. What the test shows is how well the detector handles that particular test. The ones that do better are remarkable , but that don't mean the ones that don't do as well have " problems " , especially if they cost half as much.

I am not saying detectors like the Deus aren't better at some things or more capable in certain situations , .....only that a designed test is not an accurate representation of the real world. They have more in common with an air test for depth than you realize. A detector that does GREAT in an open air simulation , or even an IN GROUND FRESH BURY ,......can really disappoint in the real deal once its subjected to a completely new set of variables. The same can and does work in reverse , a detector that don't fare so well with the test can and sometimes does handle the real world variables a lot better.

So ultimately , the only " accurate " test of a machines all 'round ability and performance is a real world hunt. And the only accurate comparison that can be made is a head to head comparison on the same targets.

Is this beginning to make sense yet ?

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  #56  
Old 09-03-2017, 08:41 AM
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I'm 50 years old and have been detecting since I was 11. I've used most detectors from most manufacturers. I use what I like that makes it more enjoyable for me..the f70 f75 t2 and all of the other Fisher Tek machines are great detectors. But they do tend to give me headaches with the banging tones. I've tried different headphones,low volume etc. The 705 tones sound great and easy on my ears. The Garrett tones are also easy on my ears. So some people like me that have detected as long I have may have much different reasons to use a certain detector... Just because your all giddy and in love with the deus does NOT mean anyone else will be. Your love affair with your detector is wonderful. Write a book . But for God's sake stop selling only things you like and argue anyone else's opinions.. we have all added our opinions in forums but too much is just too much.. since I will be in Calabash North Carolina this week maybe I will try and sell you on my Z71 Silverado and tell you how it's soooooooo much better in heavy traffic than your subpar brand auto. It can separate so much better and get you through traffic wayyy better than yours.. it's soooooooo much better and faster than yours.. my extended cab makes it more balanced than yours.. my tires can go soooooooo much deeper than yours. Just watch all of my staged videos and I will prove to you that my Silverado is better than anything you own.. or your money back. Lifetime warranty included. Just 3 easy payments of $99999999.99.
It's a tossup between Calabash and TSS as to which one tries the hardest to make everyone buy what they are selling.

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  #57  
Old 09-03-2017, 09:26 AM
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I'm glad that the Deus users I've personally encountered, didn't make it their life mission to make me feel gimped that I was using anything other than a Deus. They were actually cool.

There will always be some, though, like we see here. Given the comments, they're only cementing that Deus clique, bash others mentality that makes me glad we have choices that we can be comfortable with, in this hobby!
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  #58  
Old 09-03-2017, 10:06 AM
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That's the PROBLEM all you guys think I'm selling something and I'm not I'm passing info on to people who care about such info. Some people like you don't care about info like that, your more worried about tones and such and that's part of it too. you guys can get mad and say I'm selling stuff and bashing detectors , trying to make people fell bad and what ever else. I'm passing on info to the ones who do care about things like that. I spend countless hours researching to find my old sites and I want machine that give me the edge. I'm not talking about the deus here you guys are, I showed a VIDEO OF THE patriot 399.00 DETECTOR not the 1500.00 one . You guys can say I'm a elitist and bully ,I really don't care. Maybe guys who hunt parks or swimming holes are not so much worried about the getting the edge on competition , my relic sites will never be replenished once its gone its gone. As for putting me and ole tnsharpshooter down well that's fine too at least we get off the couch and actually try to do something for the hoddy to educate the folks.. Most just run around spewing out what they been told as fact and have never put it to the test. My detector will do this blah blah blah and haven't even ever got off the couch and dug a hole and put a coin in it to see it that's really true. To me it seems like some want to keep the hobby dumbed down and run around and act like all detectors are created equal and your getting it all. If you guys want to live in that world by all means do so but don't hate on the ones who want to know how dectectors perform. I always like how people use how long they been detecting to justify how much they know its almost comical , I know know people who have been detecting 20 years and don't know squat about how detectors work or how many models they have had. Practice, testing,and studying is what counts . I know some don't care about the tech side of it and want a simple life I get it , but don't try to boo the ones off stage who do care about such things just because you don't like what they have to say. I don't try to boo people of stage I try to SHOW PROOF why it aint so. Booo as loud as you want it aint gonna change the facts.. Basstracker if you like comfort that's great and you have likes and dislikes but don't get down on us who want to know about raw performance of detectors. If you want a comfy life and easy digging by all means have at it, that's just not my world of digging. If you would have contacted me I would have took you to a 1817 house here in Calabash and maybe you could have seen im just a normal guy who has a passion for the hobbie and not a bully and a elitetist as some call me...
Originally Posted by basstrackerman View post
I'm 50 years old and have been detecting since I was 11. I've used most detectors from most manufacturers. I use what I like that makes it more enjoyable for me..the f70 f75 t2 and all of the other Fisher Tek machines are great detectors. But they do tend to give me headaches with the banging tones. I've tried different headphones,low volume etc. The 705 tones sound great and easy on my ears. The Garrett tones are also easy on my ears. So some people like me that have detected as long I have may have much different reasons to use a certain detector... Just because your all giddy and in love with the deus does NOT mean anyone else will be. Your love affair with your detector is wonderful. Write a book . But for God's sake stop selling only things you like and argue anyone else's opinions.. we have all added our opinions in forums but too much is just too much.. since I will be in Calabash North Carolina this week maybe I will try and sell you on my Z71 Silverado and tell you how it's soooooooo much better in heavy traffic than your subpar brand auto. It can separate so much better and get you through traffic wayyy better than yours.. it's soooooooo much better and faster than yours.. my extended cab makes it more balanced than yours.. my tires can go soooooooo much deeper than yours. Just watch all of my staged videos and I will prove to you that my Silverado is better than anything you own.. or your money back. Lifetime warranty included. Just 3 easy payments of $99999999.99.
It's a tossup between Calabash and TSS as to which one tries the hardest to make everyone buy what they are selling.

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  #59  
Old 09-03-2017, 10:16 AM
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Why you talking about the deus here ? The video was of the patriot and pro not the deus.... You guys act like someone shot your dog and killed it! You guys talk about my love affair with the deus really have you looked at your love affair with your brand?? Can show it failing miserably and you guys will defend it to the end something very wrong with that. Who really has a love affair going?? yhall better go look in the mirror.
Originally Posted by Curbdog View post
I'm glad that the Deus users I've personally encountered, didn't make it their life mission to make me feel gimped that I was using anything other than a Deus. They were actually cool.

There will always be some, though, like we see here. Given the comments, they're only cementing that Deus clique, bash others mentality that makes me glad we have choices that we can be comfortable with, in this hobby!

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  #60  
Old 09-03-2017, 10:58 AM
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AT Pro Bro ,,Where you at? If he shows up he'll straighten this mess out..lol...

The At pro is a great machine,and what's not understood here is sometimes people don't want all that horsepower of a hypersensative machine.I know for a fact there are better performing machines than the at pro under certain conditions..But I don't want that kinda of horse power,not all the time.
It's warranted in some situations I agree.But not all situations,and I definitely agree with the tones of the at pro and 705 as stated above by Basstrackerman,,,they're much nicer than higher priced machines.
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