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  #141  
Old 08-31-2017, 11:56 PM
davidlhyde63366 davidlhyde63366 is online now
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Default Japanese treasure

Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View post
Not sure how you jump from someone pointing out "more plausible explanations", to this other extreme. OF COURSE if proof is offered, then it ceases to be the camp-fire-legend lore caliber story.


IMHO the measure of a good and true treasure hunter is the person who asks the hard-questions of the stories he's being told. To explore if more plausible explanations exist. And the measure of a lesser qualified treasure hunter (more likely to waste time) is one that simply believes any story put in front of him, with dreamy glossed over eyes. In the end: The critical thinker is going to be the one who comes in with the most finds. JMHO
It was the current president who anounced it , the Marcos family helped him finace his election , their oldest son ran for the vice president slot last election. If they give back some of their ill gotten gain it may help him run for President next time around. Any way if there are pictures in the paper or news reports showing the current president with some of the gold bars ,you are saying you will be a belever in the Japanese treasure ?

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  #142  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:20 AM
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Default wiki article

Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View post
What about the explanation and example I posted for that in #52 ? Or how about the wiki article on the subject that gives counter data to the various points of the story ?
The same artice had Imelda Marcos saying the bulk of their wealth came from the Japanese treasure.

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  #143  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:56 AM
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I'm sure there is some truth behind the treasure story. Some has been blown out of proportion... 100s of hidden caches... treasure maps.. etc. Most is a load of horse sh/t by someone trying to make a buck somewhere down the line.

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  #144  
Old 09-01-2017, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Steve View post
I'm sure there is some truth behind the treasure story. Some has been blown out of proportion... 100s of hidden caches... treasure maps.. etc. Most is a load of horse sh/t by someone trying to make a buck somewhere down the line.
I believe the 100s of hidden caches part of it.Probably 1000's of small caches. Soldiers have been looting and pillaging as long as there has been soldiers, and people have been hiding their loot from soldiers just as long. Then the soldiers are stealing from each other and hiding the loot or they are hiding it so it doesn't get stolen.
I know where a soldier's cache is located in Wildflecken Germany. Thirty year old beer might not be worth much today, but in 1983 it was TREASURE.
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  #145  
Old 09-01-2017, 09:35 AM
davidlhyde63366 davidlhyde63366 is online now
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Thumbs up Japanese soldiers

Originally Posted by Scooterjim View post
I believe the 100s of hidden caches part of it.Probably 1000's of small caches. Soldiers have been looting and pillaging as long as there has been soldiers, and people have been hiding their loot from soldiers just as long. Then the soldiers are stealing from each other and hiding the loot or they are hiding it so it doesn't get stolen.
I know where a soldier's cache is located in Wildflecken Germany. Thirty year old beer might not be worth much today, but in 1983 it was TREASURE.
Most of the Japanese soldiers were the poor mainly farmers and fishermen when pressed in to service , they were poorly treated by their own comanding officers . They often had to do with inadiquate equipment and supplies , in harsh condition so they were brutal to the local populations. They looted any thing they could get their hands on, sometimes burrying it ,or hiding it some place they would be able to finnd again in hopes of returning later and enriching their lives after the war was over. Many of these smaller stashes were never found due to the soldiers being killed.

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  #146  
Old 09-01-2017, 09:43 AM
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Default Marcos to return so of the money they looted from the Philippines

Originally Posted by ncauclair View post
Wow. A senior Philippine politician recently reported that Imelda Marcos said she had 7,000 bars of gold she would be willing to donate to the Philippine government. I wonder if she keeps the gold with her shoes. Would explain nicely where Yamashita's treasure went. See-- my Steel's Treasure and Steel's Gold novels weren't lies. You can see the article on my ncauclair homepage here.
http://philippineslifestyle.com/blog...llion-dollars/
There are lots of news papers covering this story so any one interested can also google marcos gold bars and lots of links and diffrent papers will come up. Nick has posted one on his blog so be sure to check it out.

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  #147  
Old 09-01-2017, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by davidlhyde63366 View post
..... news reports showing the current president with some of the gold bars ,you are saying you will be a belever in the Japanese treasure ?
Only if the gold bars are shown to have lineage/source to "Japan's plunder hidden, then found, on Philippine soil". And by "lineage/source", I mean: Not just ghost-story heresay and silly answers by pestered public officials. As I alluded to in post #52, and gave an example of.

Don't forget: MANY countries (eg.: USA @ Ft. Knox) can show "pictures of gold bars". Since when is such a picture some sort of smoking gun of "looted treasures" ? If so, then what's the conspiracy source for our Ft. Knox bars ?

But ... humorously ..... Let's just grant for a moment that all the gold held by the Marcos did indeed have it's source this way. Then why oh why oh why oh why does there continue to be supposed treasures still waiting to be found, from the same supposed Yamashita source ? I will save time and beat others to the punch-line:

Because the Yamashita went all around the Philippines, NOT just burying the one treasure that gave the Marco's all their wealth. NNeeeooohh , he buried hundreds of them. Hence the hundreds of maps that circulate. All it takes is to wander the jungles looking for uncanny scratches or squiggles on rocks. Any cave, swamp, mountain peak, etc.... are all final resting places for the 100's more than Yamashita buried, right ? Scooter Jim has already now given this answer.
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  #148  
Old 09-01-2017, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by davidlhyde63366 View post
Most of the Japanese soldiers were the poor mainly farmers and fishermen when pressed in to service , they were poorly treated by their own comanding officers . They often had to do with inadiquate equipment and supplies , in harsh condition so they were brutal to the local populations. They looted any thing they could get their hands on, sometimes burrying it ,or hiding it some place they would be able to finnd again in hopes of returning later and enriching their lives after the war was over. Many of these smaller stashes were never found due to the soldiers being killed.
Granted. Soldiers have enjoyed the plunders and spoils of wars on/in ANY continent, during ANY war. Can you name one continent or war where this WASN'T the case ?? I mean, check out what the Russian soldiers were doing when they came into Germany at the final 6 months of the European war. Looted every town they came to.

So why is it just the Philippines where these fabled treasure laden caves are said to still-be-waiting to be found ? And what of the logical counter-evidences that it would have been silly for Japan to have spirited away their Chinese conquest spoils in the Philippines of all places ? (requiring shipping from the mainland, blah blah ). I mean, that's sort of the logistics are irrational. You would take your plundered loot back to your capitol, not another of your conquest territories.
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  #149  
Old 09-01-2017, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Steve View post
I'm sure there is some truth behind the treasure story. Some has been blown out of proportion... 100s of hidden caches... treasure maps.. etc. Most is a load of horse sh/t by someone trying to make a buck somewhere down the line.
Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View post
Granted. Soldiers have enjoyed the plunders and spoils of wars on/in ANY continent, during ANY war. Can you name one continent or war where this WASN'T the case ?? I mean, check out what the Russian soldiers were doing when they came into Germany at the final 6 months of the European war. Looted every town they came to.

So why is it just the Philippines where these fabled treasure laden caves are said to still-be-waiting to be found ? And what of the logical counter-evidences that it would have been silly for Japan to have spirited away their Chinese conquest spoils in the Philippines of all places ? (requiring shipping from the mainland, blah blah ). I mean, that's sort of the logistics are irrational. You would take your plundered loot back to your capitol, not another of your conquest territories.
Even the local Filipinos don't believe it anymore. It's the outsiders who are easily influenced into believing this stuff. Believe me, anyone coming close to any alleged gold, would have their throats slit before they could get their hands on it. This is why they refer to this story as "blood money" over there.
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  #150  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Happa54 View post
Even the local Filipinos don't believe it anymore......
Well .... some. Others there still ardently believe.

Treasure fever is so hard to put down. You can't dis-believe. The human mind wants SO HARD to believe in it (why do you think the Oak Island nonsense has gone on for so long ?). And the reason you can't quell a treasure legend (no matter how strong the counter-logic is): Is because of the psychology of "No one wants to be left out". No one wants to be laughed at by the other person "all the way to the bank". Everyone subconsciously entertains *what if?* notions. With visions of stacks of gold bars. So we put aside critical thinking and more plausible explanations. "Lest we be left out".
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  #151  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View post

So why is it just the Philippines where these fabled treasure laden caves are said to still-be-waiting to be found ? And what of the logical counter-evidences that it would have been silly for Japan to have spirited away their Chinese conquest spoils in the Philippines of all places ? (requiring shipping from the mainland, blah blah ). I mean, that's sort of the logistics are irrational. You would take your plundered loot back to your capitol, not another of your conquest territories.
I think it has something to do with the Philippines still being wild and exotic. Pygmies, lions and tigers and bears, the people that are living basically like cavemen make for a better story than a Russian soldier hiding a stash behind a German bierhaus. Never let the truth get in the way of a good story.
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  #152  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Scooterjim View post
I believe the 100s of hidden caches part of it.Probably 1000's of small caches. Soldiers have been looting and pillaging as long as there has been soldiers, and people have been hiding their loot from soldiers just as long. Then the soldiers are stealing from each other and hiding the loot or they are hiding it so it doesn't get stolen.
I know where a soldier's cache is located in Wildflecken Germany. Thirty year old beer might not be worth much today, but in 1983 it was TREASURE.
Probably true for every country. But not the original cache from the guy that did the looting. It's inconceivable that he would bury his stolen treasure in 100s of hidden places.. there might have been some truth to the story of a hidden cache of loot... without going overboard

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  #153  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Scooterjim View post
I think it has something to do with the Philippines still being wild and exotic. Pygmies, lions and tigers and bears, the people that are living basically like cavemen make for a better story ...
Yup. And the more poison darts, boobie traps, caves you can add (think "Raiders of the Lost Ark"), then the more true it becomes. Don't forget to add 6 meters (Or hundreds of feet deep as at Oak Island). The deeper it is said to be, then the more true it must be. Right ? And have you ever noticed that the size of said-treasure increases with the depth ? The deeper it is, then by golly, the bigger it is. The more remote and inaccessible the spot (cave, swamp, mountain top, etc...) the place is, then the MORE likely that a treasure awaits you there. Right ?
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  #154  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View post
Granted. Soldiers have enjoyed the plunders and spoils of wars on/in ANY continent, during ANY war. Can you name one continent or war where this WASN'T the case ?? I mean, check out what the Russian soldiers were doing when they came into Germany at the final 6 months of the European war. Looted every town they came to.

So why is it just the Philippines where these fabled treasure laden caves are said to still-be-waiting to be found ? And what of the logical counter-evidences that it would have been silly for Japan to have spirited away their Chinese conquest spoils in the Philippines of all places ? (requiring shipping from the mainland, blah blah ). I mean, that's sort of the logistics are irrational. You would take your plundered loot back to your capitol, not another of your conquest territories.
The loot was from mainland China ?

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  #155  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Steve View post
The loot was from mainland China ?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanking_Massacre
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  #156  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View post
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanking_Massacre
I used to live about an hour from there. No place to look for caches or even metal detect for about 100 miles or so. Pretty sure the local citizens have very little, if any, personal gold or silver. Temples and other places I don't know

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  #157  
Old 09-04-2017, 10:52 AM
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Default hidden treasure

Originally Posted by Steve View post
Probably true for every country. But not the original cache from the guy that did the looting. It's inconceivable that he would bury his stolen treasure in 100s of hidden places.. there might have been some truth to the story of a hidden cache of loot... without going overboard
I imagine the reason the Japaneses used multible locations to hide their looted treasure was they wanted to be sure most of the treasure would be there when they came back. They expected the war to turn around and to be able to retake the Philippines. They vevy much wanted the Philippines to be part of the new Japanese Empire. With over 7000 islands and lots of resources, deep water ports ,important to the navy and shipping . They weren't putting all their eggs in one basket.

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  #158  
Old 09-08-2017, 12:01 AM
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Default Marcos gold & cash loot

From what the news papers are reporting it looks likes the Marcos are waiting for the goverment to make a settlement offer , for all the law suits agains them. They are wanting a clean slate so President Marcos son has a clear shot at running for President next election. With out the law suite hanging over his head he has a fairly good chance since every one knows the name. Compared to the current president he would apear a lot more stable. It will be interesting to see how much cash , and gold they offer to give back to the treasury. The country could definatly put it to good use to help the poor.

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  #159  
Old 09-12-2017, 10:50 PM
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Default Philippines during the 1980's

Originally Posted by Scooterjim View post
I think it has something to do with the Philippines still being wild and exotic. Pygmies, lions and tigers and bears, the people that are living basically like cavemen make for a better story than a Russian soldier hiding a stash behind a German bierhaus. Never let the truth get in the way of a good story.
During the Mid 1980's the Philippines was a pretty wild and exotic place, only about 40 years since World War II . Most houses had no phones , international calle were usally made in call centers where you paid for a connection and it usally wasn't very good. Whei i called my wife to be i was luck to hear every 3rd word. The internet wasn't around yet, so main comunication was by mail or word of mouth. Subistute coberas , big spiders , sea snakes for the lions and tigers. Lots of suberstition and beliefs in things like witches. It was a wild place then , but very diffrent now. Now the philippines is a mix of old and new you will find modern malls and many old churches 300-400 years old,every one has a cell phone. There is a lot of corruption there ,they love American culture music , food movies clothes. Many people have relatives over here in the States or Canada. With over 7000 islands it is a very interesting place to see and visit,with lots of history.

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Last edited by davidlhyde63366; 09-13-2017 at 08:52 AM.
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  #160  
Old 09-13-2017, 08:33 AM
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I'd like to go just to ride with these guys.
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