People complaining about my digger

Metal detecto said:

I know, every one metal detecting says that you need to cut the plug nicely, make a hinge, pinpoint it, blah blah blah, and I am! Every single one of my plugs is a masterpiece, heck, if you tried to find it you won't. But everyone kinda doesn't like my shovel, lesche sampson that I love very dearly, and especially my lesche hand tool. I'm kind of tired of people giving me a look that's sometimes as dirty as my find. How do you manage to MD in peace?

Click to expand...

soundsgood said:

I don't post much but I know what you are saying. I started detecting in 1975, Southern Cal. Used a Whites 6DB. Old school deep machine. You name the park, I have hit it. Lots of holes for lots of years. Never ran into other detectorist or plug police. No shovels. We always used a small spade. Digging was discreet and neat. Park workers were the only ones we encountered. Really never had a problem. Just too many detectors now and some that are not so neat. I'm not in Cal no more, but if I was I would still use a small spade or my lesche and be looking over my backside. Too many opinionated people today that will attack you. I like old parks but now an old desert trail seems better.

Click to expand...

randy said:

I don't know where you are detecting, but most people don't use "shovels" in areas where there are lots of passersby. IMHO anyway, they make more sense in fields and woods and some permission sites.

Click to expand...

Tom_in_CA said:

Yup. And NO AMOUNT of going in ahead of time (preemptive permission seeking) and trying to "sort out this mess of definitions" solves this dilemma . It will only ACCELERATE the no's.

Click to expand...

georgeinsc said:

I was in a city in Nc. Went to a local soccer complex and was told You can not dig here. I could pop coins if they were shallow but no digging. I was to". ld go ahead and detect the tot lots. I asked what had happened to cause the change in policy and was told "Guys Were Digging Up Our Soccer Fields With SHOVELS. A check of the city rules for their parks says "No Metal Detecting" And all because of the visual of some one diging with a shove

Click to expand...

Tom_in_CA said:

George, sometimes, when people say that others "left holes" or "had shovels", this can sometimes merely be because someone saw a guy with a metal detector stoop to dig. So the observer MERELY ASSUMED: "holes" or "he's going to leave holes". It doesn't necessarily mean the md'r left any, nor actually had a shovel. It can just be the mental image that the busy-body assumed.

Click to expand...

Saker said:

Most folks that come up to me are just interested in what I am doing and ask questions about the hobby. I really enjoy it and have no problem talking to people about it. When anyone does try to give me a hard time I just stare at them, make myself look mad, and growl until they leave. It works every time!

Click to expand...

stursmad said:

I've made my thoughts known before on this subject, but here they are again in a nutshell. I believe long handled shovels and making/leaving a mess are the top two things that will lead to public areas being banned to metal detecting. Can't say I didn't warn you.

Click to expand...

georgeinsc said:

Tom i am fully aware of the perspective but when i am talking to the Man in Charge of a city recreation park and he tells me that he approached city counsel and requested the ban then i am fairly sure that i am being told the truth and it was because of "Shovels"

There was no discussion as to whether they left holes. he was upset because shovels were being used.

I dont now how to explain it any better.

Click to expand...

Tom_in_CA said:

You've explained it just fine. And when someone says "holes" or "shovels" (as the reason for suggested ban), I don't doubt that in-their-mind they are "telling the truth" as they see it. But as said : They can simply develop this impression SIMPLY because they "saw someone with a metal detector" who "stopped to dig".

And yes, even "men in charge of city rec. parks" can get this perception, by the simple sight of a man stooping to dig. Whether or not they did or didn't have a long handled shovel. The moment they see a man detecting (even if it were a short-handled shovel, it is now a "shovel", period)

And so, believe it or not, the next person hearing the word "shovel" conjurs up images of full-long-handled "shovel". Not saying it's a good idea to use long-handled shovels (for perception-image-sakes). Just saying that when we md'rs hear the word "shovel" and "holes", we can mistakingly jump to the conclusion : Durned that "Someone who must've have a long-handled shovel" or "Durned that someone who must've left holes". When in fact, maybe it never actually went down like that.

Click to expand...

Tom_in_CA said:

GKL : that is not a website put forth by an administering agency. It is an md'ing hobbyist website. Not anything put out by any form of city or county in their area. Where are they getting that there is "approved shovels" (long-handled ??) that some particular city , near them "gave a stamp of approval for" ?

And even if they can indeed show any city had a "rule" allowing "long handled (?) shovels" for their parks, this really doesn't add much to the discussion. Because guess what the average newbie would do, upon hearing/reading such a thing ? Drumroll : They'll Rush to their nearest city hall desk and start disputing/discussing/questioning "length of shovel handles". Eh ? And then guess what happens next ?

Click to expand...

KOB said:

Absolutely perfect ! Most people with a brain will stand back and watch a bit if you have a shovel. Covering your hole and not making a mess in a park is the key. Big shovel or little trowel , no difference. Perception or not. MOST people that is. Not much different watching to see if someone picks up their dog poop in a park. Mad dog stare down ? These busy bodies are getting off easy....

But I digress to one of my favorite movies of all time. Mr.Brooks...Where Kevin Costner makes Dane Cook dig his own grave in the cemetery. Then swings that shovel at his neck as he falls in.....

Click to expand...

GKL said:

.....I understand there always seem to be some that might "upset the apple cart" by asking officials without first simply just researching online to see if something is specifically prohibited in an area

It seems like the Maryland/Baltimore permit that allows for detecting and using shovels specifically designed for detecting has been in effect for a while so while it might not prevent any bad digging from happening it seems like the officials are satisfied enough to continue allowing it.

http://bcrp.baltimorecity.gov/sites/default/files/Metal%20Detecting%20Applications%202017.pdf

This other quote from that official document shows the officials are aware there might be some individuals that might leave bad digs but instead of simply revoking it for everyone they ask the responsible detectorists to repair such digs when found:

......quote from that document:

".......It is requested that detectorists repair poorly repaired holes left behind by uneducated or careless individuals. This effort will help protect the privilege of metal detecting in Baltimore City Parks......"
(end of quote)

......it's encouraging to know there are officials who don't want to automatically prohibit something simply because of the few individuals who might leave bad digs.

Click to expand...

IDXMonster said:

Has someone actually come up to you and said something about your shovel? Or are you simply thinking that they don’t like your shovel? I gave up caring what people think a long time ago. You know what they say about a-holes and opinions...I just don’t care. Don’t go skulking around like a guilty dog, THAT will get you noticed more than anything. OWN that place! Smile big, direct eye contact and wave, continue with business. It’s takes some people time to be comfortable hunting in public places, and the more you do it the more you’ll become just another unthreatening fixture in said public places. Just like that tree, that bush, that person who walks their dog every day...

Click to expand...

Huckleberry said:

That is SPOT-ON! Public perception is key. it doesn't matter how fine a plug you can make with a shovel, the perception of someone with a shovel invokes visions of holes and messes. In the end, mine or your perception of how fine a job was done on a target retrieval is immaterial, John Q Public or "lookie lou" or maintenance staff, ect. sees someone with a shovel in a public place, and their perceived reality of what we do becomes set in their minds, and nothing you or I can change that perception once their mind is made up!

There are many tools in the detectorist toolbox. Sure, use a shovel in the woods, in plowed fields, or in your own yard for that matter. But discretion is the better part of valor. Use a hand trowel or probe in public places.

When public areas become closed to detecting, our opinions do not change the closed status. It's still off limits! Leaving a site in as good or better condition than it was before you got there is important. That gives an impression of metal detecting. Likewise, how we conduct ourselves while detecting, as well as what tools we are using gives the public an impression of metal detecting.

So, in the end, dig with what you will, you're going to anyway, no matter what is discussed here. But when an area becomes closed to detecting, you will have no one to blame but yourself. So enjoy the fruits of your labors!

Click to expand...

Max houser said:

just gonna say it... shovels are for old people... if your young, cut that plug with a hand trowel such as the lesche... been doing this for almost 20 years... I don't carry a shovel, or a "lesche like shovel". it would actually slow me down... and i have have found ALOT over the years. a few that have hunted with me can't beleive how many times I get up and down compared to them... get it and move on...

Click to expand...

just gonna say it... shovels are for old people... if your young, cut that plug with a hand trowel such as the lesche

Click to expand...

GKL said:

Wow, I came across encouraging info showing some areas actually state they are okay with shovels as long as they are specifically designed for metal detecting:

http://marylandfreestateclub.com/FAQ.html

Click to expand...