Sears is going down...

I still use outdoor sporting gear to this day that was purchased from K-Mart back in the 1900's because it was built with quality in the USA! Can't so much say that about today's foreign made goods. Not saying everything is bad but probably most. So sad to see these stores vanish along with quality because of corporate greed

Walknstik said:

I still use outdoor sporting gear to this day that was purchased from K-Mart back in the 1900's because it was built with quality in the USA! Can't so much say that about today's foreign made goods. Not saying everything is bad but probably most. So sad to see these stores vanish along with quality because of corporate greed

Click to expand...

So, I'm not 100% on board with the corporate greed thing. Sales have more to do with marketing and consumer consumption. If it was due to corporate greed the board would be getting the marketing personnel in place to figure it out and drive sales and drive profits.

IMO, it has more to do with old school thinking and not being reactive to the markets and (here is where I pi$$ off half the readers) cheap consumers trying to save a penny.

The reduction in US manufacturing is consumer driven. Right or wrong but if we are willing to save dollars by buying a foreign product, why would we expect the business to survive.

Big Treble said:

So, I'm not 100% on board with the corporate greed thing. Sales have more to do with marketing and consumer consumption. If it was due to corporate greed the board would be getting the marketing personnel in place to figure it out and drive sales and drive profits.

IMO, it has more to do with old school thinking and not being reactive to the markets and (here is where I pi$$ off half the readers) cheap consumers trying to save a penny.

The reduction in US manufacturing is consumer driven. Right or wrong but if we are willing to save dollars by buying a foreign product, why would we expect the business to survive.

Click to expand...

In this case it has a lot to do with... mostly to do with one person, a smart financial guy who has a demi-God complex with no retail experience that has gone rogue.
He has some strange ideas that never worked, will never work and won't listen to anyone under him with more retail experience.
He has loaned Sears a ton of money from his other company but is protecting himself by funneling it back to another pocket by way of other methods.
He is protecting himself pretty well, the future and welfare of everyone else in the world of Sears does not seem to matter to him at all.
It is a case of greed,insanity or both.
His management team...those that are left, are paralyzed with fear because of his crazy and illogical actions, his venders are cutting him off one by one and his employees are trying to plug holes at the store level as best they can but with half the required bodies needed and so little stock available it is a lost cause.
Another person, a smarter, saner retail person might have been able to save this company.
This was a case of the wrong person doing the wrong things at all the wrong times for a decade.
In the wake of Amazon and all that is happening in retail now they needed to change and adapt into something else more modern, vertically integrated and suited for doing business in the 21st century but this was the exact wrong guy to lead them to do it.
My opinion, anyway.

Here is pretty much the whole story about what is actually happening inside the company up to today...
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/inside-sears-death-spiral-billionaire-134128865.html

DIGGER27 said:

In this case it has a lot to do with... mostly to do with one person, a smart financial guy who has a demi-God complex with no retail experience that has gone rogue.
He has some strange ideas that never worked, will never work and won't listen to anyone under him with more retail experience.
He has loaned Sears a ton of money from his other company but is protecting himself by funneling it back to another pocket by way of other methods.
He is protecting himself pretty well, the future and welfare of everyone else in the world of Sears does not seem to matter to him at all.
It is a case of greed,insanity or both.
His management team...those that are left, are paralyzed with fear because of his crazy and illogical actions, his venders are cutting him off one by one and his employees are trying to plug holes at the store level as best they can but with half the required bodies uneeded and so little stock available it is a lost cause.
Another person, a smarter, saner retail person might have been able to save this company.
This was a case of the wrong person doing the wrong things at all the wrong times for a decade.
In the wake of Amazon and all that is happening in retail now they needed to change and adapt into something else suited for doing business in the 21st century, this was the exact wrong guy to lead them to do it.
My opinion, anyway.

Here is pretty much the whole story up to today...
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/inside-sears-death-spiral-billionaire-134128865.html

Click to expand...

The wife just retired from a recent spin off from. Sears Holdings your analysis is dead on, but my interpretation is still, old school, inept, poor business management, shallow thinking & poor marketing. Corporate greed would make them fight harder for profits, and
that hasn't happened since he appeared on the scene.

Big Treble said:

The wife just retired from a recent spin off from. Sears Holdings your analysis is dead on, but my interpretation is still, old school, inept, poor business management, shallow thinking & poor marketing. Corporate greed would make them fight harder for profits, and
that hasn't happened since he appeared on the scene.

Click to expand...

Some older Michiganders will fondly remember this.

In Michigan we had a chain of department stores called Federal Department Stores....we all just called them Federal's, pretty popular and had been around since 1929 and was not near as big with only about 60 stores but known to most as a poor man's Sears.
Many a childhood memory were tied to shopping in this place because they were everywhere or seemed that way.
In 1970 they declared bankruptcy but managed to stick around, in 1978 a guy named Steve West bought what was left of another chain called Robert Hall.
He was supposedly a self made millionaire, sold several financial self help books but it turned out he was actually a big film flam artist, a scammer of Barnum proportions but nobody knew that yet.
He showed up at the sale with a briefcase he said supposedly was filled with millions, actually all he had was blank paper covered by a few thousand, but he somehow he gained control of the whole shebang and sold all the assets off.
Not long after he made a play for struggling Federal's.


"On October 31, 1977, three days after the page-one Journal story about the Robert Hall sale, West again made headlines in that newspaper -- this time because he purchased 25 percent of the common stock of Federal's, a department-store chain concentrated in Detroit. The hostile takeover spurred Federal's board of directors to attempt to oust him; when they sued, West locked himself in his office at Federal's for four hours. Lawyers for the store informed the would-be tycoon that a judge had ordered him to leave.

But after West triumphed in court in March 1978, he gained control of Federal's.

Then the fun began.
First thing he did was talk big about saving the company with newspaper ads and did a lot of goofy tv ads with his wife.
Almost immediately the fires started.
One by one like clockwork stores were catching on fire weekly and were destroyed or shut down after, everybody suspected it was him but nobody could ever prove a thing.
At one time he came out publicly and said he was willing to take a lie detector test but he never did.
One of the funniest ads I ever saw was after several burned West made a new commercial with him dressed up as a fireman holding a big fire hose and he said he was planning to announce another big fire sale...but they didn't have a fire that week.
I almost fell on the floor laughing first time I saw it...if nothing else the guy had chutzpah.

Near the end he took letters off many of the stores and renamed them deral's, a few were changed to ed's, and said they were now discount and bargain centers...anything to keep them going for as long as possible.

I have no idea where the board of directors were during all this, what they could have done, if anything, to stop him but nobody did.

He drained everything he could and by 1980 the chain was closed for good because he neglected to pay venders, taxes, fees and everything else that you need to do to run a retail business.
Here is his story and what became of him in later years, pretty funny and interesting.
http://www.browardpalmbeach.com/news/wild-wild-west-6343483

I only mention all this because in a funny way it reminds me of Sears, although that is a much more long, complicated and drawn out affair.

Yea kmart is closing here in st clairsville Ohio.

Tick...Tick...Tick...

https://www.thestreet.com/story/139...tml?puc=yahoo&cm_ven=YAHOO&yptr=yahoo&ref=yfp


"Sears also entered into a $500 million secured loan facility with Lampert's hedge fund ESL Investments. Of the total, $321 million was funded under the loan facility, with the remaining $179 million available for withdrawal in the future. In a sign of Sears' beleaguered financial state, the loan bears an interest rate of 8%."

Marketing can be summed up into one glorious statement, this applies to everything marketed to Mankind.....401k's, Health Insurance, Retirement plans, Condo Time shares, Mortgages, Student Loans, Payday advances, Cash for Gold, Zero Down......whatever......Sooner or later a guy eventually figures it out..."Be sure to drink your Ovaltine"?.... <<<Deleted by Admin>>>!
Mud

Watch your swearing Mud.

Now even they stopped lying, it has gone too far for them to keep it up anymore.
Everyone else knew they were doomed long ago but they kept pretending nobody suspected.

https://www.thestreet.com/story/140...tml?puc=yahoo&cm_ven=YAHOO&yptr=yahoo&ref=yfp

Sears has been on life support for some time.
If not for craftsman tools,,and their charge cards they would already be history.

Wallyworld,,has had Sears,,Kmart and Jc Penneys in their gun sights now for a while.

Really the only thing that will be left as we know it will be Target and Dollar General Stores.
And when these others finally fold,,,Target will be next to sight in on.

Dollar general stores,,,Wally world targeting them,,but made a big mistake,,,and has since sold off most of the little Wally World stores.

Dollar General is safe,,,since it deals with a lot of smallest towns in USA.

I can't wait to be able to buy craftsman tools at Wally World.

Too far to drive to go to almost sunken Sears.

Btw when Montomery Wards folded,,Sears thought they had clear sailing.
How wrong they were.

http://www.nytimes.com/2000/12/29/business/montgomery-ward-to-close-its-doors.html

With the actual death of Sears imminent, I will say that I am anxiously awaiting the actual going out of business sale.

BottleCapKing said:

With the actual death of Sears imminent, I will say that I am anxiously awaiting the actual going out of business sale.

Click to expand...

HEY Guys--I went into our local Sears today (1st time in a year and a half) to pick up one of those little Consumer Cellphones, and was shocked to see only "2" employees in the whole selling floor. There were most likely others in the back or in the warehouse but I was shocked to see how far it has gone down. Almost no consumer electronics at all. The salesperson said there was no profit there anymore so they ditched those.

Bankruptcy!

They lasted longer than I thought they would but that was only because the idiot leader kept giving loans to the company, selling off as much property as possible and selling off many of the most valuable brands.
Still, what most knew was inevitable finally has happened.
https://www.aol.com/article/finance/2018/10/15/sears-has-filed-for-chapter-11-bankruptcy/23561227/


Smart businesses people have been saying for years this guy had no clue about running a retail business, not an inkling of a clue.
He has blamed everyone but himself, the customers, workers, executives, Amazon and other competitors...even the people on pensions.

They might still hold off on total liquidation for awhile, there have been many companies that went bankrupt and still managed to reorganize and come back.
This guy has been saying that about everything he has been doing to the company for years, if you think this bankruptcy will have a positive effect in any way at any time now or in the future I have some nice shiny bridges for sale we need to talk about.

The big reason I am so mad about this is because I grew up during a time when this store, and brand, was iconic.
This was the Amazon of their time for decades, with smarter leadership they maybe could have been Amazon.
They made their bones using their catalog and the U.S. mail, they turned that into brick and mortar stores with one of the biggest footprints retail has ever seen here in the U.S.
If only they could have changed again.
They didn't forsee the rise of internet shopping, not many large retail companies did, but at one time they had tons of money, customers, business and more goodwill than most others.
They just couldn't capitalize on any of it and somehow they managed to let one of the dumbest people on the planet get control.
Well, maybe not so dumb because he may end up being one of the few that end up with money at the end of all of this but we will see.

I was a customer, I bought Craftsman tools when they were made in America and took advantage of that great warranty a few times.
Plenty of my back to school and other clothes came from one of their stores as did a whole slew of other products over the years.

This upsets me as it probably does anyone from my generation that remembers what Sears used to be and stood for.
I can buy from anyone but the last time I was in a Sears store I was shocked at what they became and then they closed it.
It felt like looking at a dying relative hooked up to tubes lying in a hospital bed and no hope.

Who knows if this company will survive in any form, even just the name on some website, but their iconic days are long over.
They will be remembered for years to come but probably not as a revered American retail entity but as a huge lesson in how badly things can turn with the wrong leadership.

A shame.
I wonder how well all the people that have pensions will weather all of this.
They will probably still get checks thanks to the government but health insurance...not so much.
For many this might turn into a nightmare.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-biz-sears-bankruptcy-pension-default-20181011-story.html

Growing up in the country on a farm we had an oversized mailbox. My Grandparents did all of their shopping by mail from Sears and Montgomery Wards catalogs. We had a blacksmith shop that I saw advertized in the reprint of a 1903 Sears catalog. I believe now Montgomery Wards is an online operation. Perhaps that is what sears will do.

Two years now and they still aren’t down!

Silversmith45 said:

Growing up in the country on a farm we had an oversized mailbox. My Grandparents did all of their shopping by mail from Sears and Montgomery Wards catalogs. We had a blacksmith shop that I saw advertized in the reprint of a 1903 Sears catalog. I believe now Montgomery Wards is an online operation. Perhaps that is what sears will do.

Click to expand...

Going back to their roots, I guess. Both Sears and Monkey Wards started out as mail order companies.

Amazon will obsolete a lot of businesses.

Little side note. Because of this thread, it reminded me of the "Texas Steer Boots" I used to buy at Kmart. I just tried to order a pair on the Kmart website. I got all the way through the checkout and when I hit the button to place order, the site froze up? I have no confirmation the order was placed. So much for the nostalgia of trying to help out......

Bad News

I have all Craftsman tools, never had a problem returning broken tool's to get new, no sears , when they brake there DONE

CTCurt said:

Sears lost me years ago. My wife and I were rehabbing our house and went there for pricing on all the appliances we needed...(Stove,fridge,dishwasher,hoodfan, washer,dryer). The salesperson didn't seem interested at all in speaking to us. I think the fact we were very young, and how could we have that kind of cash to spend. But we did...and we didn't spend it there. I remember as a kid looking through their wishbook around Christmas. Boy, the things I wanted. Mini bikes, bb guns, fishing poles.... Very sad they have gotten to this point. K-Mart is a shambles also, (haven't been there in years). They ruined Lands End too.....

Click to expand...

I used to go in sears to price the Kenmore stuff like appliances and mowers. Then just go look for a whirlpool or Murray mower in another type store and pay a lot less for not having a kenmore label. You ought to know about their garbage disposals if you ever saw a kenmore Badger 5