Friendly Metal Detecting Forums   River Team 6 Metal Detectors
List all sponsors

Go Back   Friendly Metal Detecting Forums > Metal Detecting > Beach and Water Hunting

Reply
  
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-17-2019, 03:18 AM
cutaplug's Avatar
cutaplug cutaplug is offline
Full Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 214
Default Experienced Beach Hunters Only - Equinox 800 sucks - What should I replace it with?

Before all the EQ800 owners mob me please hear me out. I am a lot more mature than my title. I think... Anyway I have been silver hunting for many years and would consider myself one of the best. My primary silver seekers are the ctx and etrac. My last push to find a lot of silver netted me 136 silvers in less than 3 months using the CTX. I believe the key to being productive while metal detecting is detecting efficiently. By hunting efficiently what I mean is:

1. Ability to distinguish ferrous from non ferrous targets easily at any depth. This is accomplished using the FE numbers on CTX and Etrac. (detector and user)
2. Ability to define desired target and discriminate out unwanted targets with minimal loss of performance (depth, signal consistency, etc...). (detector)
3. Ability to identify targets using audio and visual information to ďskipĒ unwanted targets. (detector provides info, user deciphers info)
4. Quickly determining if a site is productive or not and moving on quickly if itís not. (user)

Using the above info I have had a lot of success and Iím content with my abilities to hunt on land. Now that my horn is tooted I could really use some help with beach hunting. I recently moved to Florida and would like to find gold. If life was simple I would be able to take my CTX and kill it on gold but life is never simple. The CTX is a great machine on silver but to say it kindly it sucks on gold. I understand why but no need to go into details on that.

Now I am on a mission to find the CTX equivalent for lower conductivity targets such as gold. When the Minelab EQ 800 was released I was super excited and optimistic. Now that Iíve used it for a while I am in search of a new machine. The main issue with the eq800 is that is cannot distinguish ferrous targets from non ferrous targets (ie rusty bottle caps). I know I know someone will chime in and say the following:
- You can change the hunting frequency and the numbers will jump. Yes this is true for a mode such as park 2 which works great on dry sand. Even using Park 2 I do not want to check every target by changing the frequency. That is extremely inefficient. Park 2 is also too unstable to get any real depth on wet sand. On wet salty sand running beach 1 you canít change the frequency since it is stuck in multi. New and Deteriorated bottle caps will give a solid signal.
- You can pump the coil up and down and see the numbers jump. Iíve seen the Youtube video, try doing that on a 12 inch target. Any 12 inch target will be all over the place you say? My response - the CTX and Etrac can easily distinguish ferrous from non ferrous targets at maximum depth capability. It is possible.
- The signal is different. I have seen solid tones on bottle caps, soft tones, scratchy tones, short tones, long tones so they have no consistency. A steel bottle cap can read #3 all the way up to the high teens on the eq800. There is no discriminating them out.

Now that Iím done ranting Iíd love to get input from experienced beach hunters about what machine is the most efficient for low conductivity targets such as gold on the beach. What Iím looking for:
1. Ability to distinguish non ferrous from ferrous easily.
2. Detector is higher frequency so good on lower conductivity targets. Not looking for too high or I will be digging tiny aluminum pieces. Would like to find a sweet spot where it will pick up small earrings but not pieces so tiny my pinpointer won't even find them.
3. Excellent depth capabilities. If it can reach the same depths of eq800 I would be happy with it.
4. Ability to set discrimination to eliminate zinc pennies and up. Iím not interested in digging silver or coins. Just looking for gold.

The CTX and Etrac are the best of the best for land hunting silver. Is there a detector that is equivalent for beach gold detecting?
Reply With Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
  #2  
Old 07-17-2019, 08:39 AM
stursmad stursmad is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 93
Default

I don't use an Equinox 800, but I wonder if switching to a concentric coil would solve the bottle cap problem?
Reply With Quote


  #3  
Old 07-17-2019, 03:15 PM
Big Treble's Avatar
Big Treble Big Treble is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: SW WI
Posts: 5,021
Default

Originally Posted by cutaplug View post
Before all the EQ800 owners mob me please hear me out. I am a lot more mature than my title. I think... Anyway I have been silver hunting for many years and would consider myself one of the best. My primary silver seekers are the ctx and etrac. My last push to find a lot of silver netted me 136 silvers in less than 3 months using the CTX. I believe the key to being productive while metal detecting is detecting efficiently. By hunting efficiently what I mean is:
Take me to the secret picnic spot you and your dad killed it on and I will tell you the gold secret. JK, I wish I knew.

Fairly hard to beat FBS when dealing with bottle caps. Many have ways to cross check, just seems the FBS is more apt to ignore them in the first place.

I know your a silver slayer with that CTX, but I guy I would recognize as a Gold Slayer with the CTX might be Leighton Harrington. Perhaps he could help with that. Just a thought.

Originally Posted by stursmad View post
I don't use an Equinox 800, but I wonder if switching to a concentric coil would solve the bottle cap problem?
pretty confident there is no concentric coil for either of those machines.

__________________
CTX, Anfibio, V3i, Tejon----Most days I'm not sure if I'm a Metal Detectorist, or a Scrap Metal Relocation Engineer.
Big Treble Outdoors Treasure Adventures -Missing big silver & anything remotely valuable since 2010.

Reply With Quote


  #4  
Old 07-17-2019, 03:36 PM
Tom_in_CA's Avatar
Tom_in_CA Tom_in_CA is online now
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 11,820
Default

Originally Posted by Bklein View post
The CTX doesnít suck on gold. I think you do need to go into detail on that.......
^^ this ^^


Cut-a-plug : Why do you think the CTX is not good on gold ? The Minelab machines like CTX, Excal, Exp II, etc... will find gold rings with ease.

Or did you mean micro-jewelry ? (eg.: tinsel thin chains, earring studs, etc...) ? If so, then as you surmised: There will be a price-to-pay for getting dainty stuff like that. You can get a pulse machine that will find that stuff with ease. But then, as you surmise: You'll have no ability to pass iron.

Or you can get the 800, and have a degree of ability to pass iron. But ... sure... it's not perfect either.

I don't see why your CTX , since you got so good with it, isn't a viable option for continuing ? It gets all standard size rings with ease. And .... frankly ... I don't see the allure of micro-jewelry (but that's just me).
Reply With Quote


  #5  
Old 07-17-2019, 08:55 AM
Charly-in-CT-RI Charly-in-CT-RI is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CT / RI / FL
Posts: 571
Default

I am not sure if I answer your question but gold is difficult to just to come by anywhere. Gold comes in different karats, sizes, and shapes therefore the VDI's (you dig everything at the beach to get gold) is anywhere from 01-23 on the NOX. The CTX gold can be first digit (09-15) and (second digit) from 01-30. If the gold is deep it can even be outside this range on both machines until you remove from sand. In the salt water the CTX my have just a little edge.

Both machines will find gold if it there. Not many machines will perform this well that has a screen. An Excal is the best in the water. It is deeper than both but it is all tone.

The is only one machine that may have an edge on gold is the Tarsacci MDT 8000. It is deeper than the CTX and NOX, has a VDI for ferrous and nonferrous but is limited on setting discrimination and it takes some getting use to and understanding how to configure it.


By the way, IN MY SOIL AND MY TRASHY PARKS, the Nox easily beats the CTX in finding silver if you set it up properly.

__________________
YTD: 3 Gold rings / 0 Silver Rings / 2 silver coins / 1 junk rings

Reply With Quote


  #6  
Old 07-17-2019, 09:55 AM
FelixtheCat's Avatar
FelixtheCat FelixtheCat is online now
A Knight of the Round Coil
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Miami
Posts: 11,048
Default

Although I am no expert on machines, I do consider myself and experienced beach hunter. I have come to think the Nox a very capable water machine but I still prefer the Excal in PP mode in open water. Less chatter and better focus on targets. I don't need a screen. Oftentimes I don't even bother switching to "discriminate" because there are so many hunters in Miami Beach and such few targets that its pretty clean and I need the break from swinging. Also I don't mind the extra bottle caps. I only dug 2 bobby pins in a 4.5 hour hunt yesterday. I much prefer the Nox in wet sand and maybe I'm wrong, but I do think its deeper than the Excal there. It is definitely lighter to swing. I will be one of those hunters taking a long hard look at spending some money when Fisher comes out with their PI. I loved using my Sand Shark which I no longer have in Miami Beach for its simplicity. As a water hunter to me its about getting to the targets and retrieving them as quickly as possible. I have seen way to many pirates out there fiddling with buttons and reading screens deciding whether to dig or not. I'd rather just dig and quickly move on.

__________________
SEEK & YOU SHALL FIND!
Founding Member of RingKeepers - A For-Profit Organization!
"THE CURE FOR ANYTHING IS SALT WATER. SWEAT, TEARS OR THE SEA" - Isak Dinesen

Reply With Quote


3 members found this post helpful.
  #7  
Old 07-17-2019, 10:43 AM
Bklein Bklein is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 273
Default

The CTX doesnít suck on gold. I think you do need to go into detail on that...Thin chains perhaps but not on their clasps or pendants. On bigger gold you can recognize the goldís pretty obvious sound. Maybe you should try better headphones or a new coil. I for one canít say the EQ is good on gold based on my use of it - I think there just wasnít any the 8 months or so I hunted with it. But others around here surely found good stuff with theirs. I always wonder if I got a bad one.
The EQ800 was frustrating to me as it has the potential to be so much better given what the CTX has shown us. Great for quarters though! :-)
I continue to be content with the CTX while anxious to see how the new detector models will perform.
Reply With Quote


  #8  
Old 07-17-2019, 09:46 AM
Noreaster Noreaster is offline
Full Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Sudbury, Ma
Posts: 123
Default

To be blunt, it seems you have an unreasonable ask / expectation.

Gold sounds and has an ID range that includes foil and many other junk items that are plentiful at the ocean. If there was a machine that could ID gold with upmost accuracy, we would all have it. My time with the NOX is not there yet, however on the few caps i found, i called them out right away, I could hear the Fe in them. We will see if my opinion on caps changes as time goes, as i had the expectation that the NOX was a fantastic cap finder (not in a good way).

If you want less junk, get in the water. Doesn't get rid of all the junk, but there is less of it.
You have a great machine in the CTX, i have always been jealous of the information that machine provides the user. If you NEED to add to your collection you can get an excal or a CZ-21 but you wont be happy if your desire is to have a certain beep on gold and only gold.

Sorry to be Mr negative.
Reply With Quote


  #9  
Old 07-17-2019, 11:02 AM
Joshc214's Avatar
Joshc214 Joshc214 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: South Florida
Posts: 489
Default

If you want to find gold on the beach you're just going to have to come to the realization that you're going to have to dig every signal, including zincs... also, beach hunting for gold isn't so much the machine your using, it's knowing when to go, what areas to hit, how currents affect certain areas, etc.. personally I've used both an excal and equinox and I'd recommend the equinox hands down.

In the past 3 months I've found over 6 ounces of gold...

__________________
NOX 800 [2020] - Gold: 4, .925: 1, Rings: 3
NOX 800 [2019] - Gold: 26, PT: 2, .925: 19, Rings: 36, Gold Chains: 3
EXCAL 2 [2017] - Gold: 31, PT: 2, .925: 28, Rings: 40, Gold Chains: 1

Reply With Quote


4 members found this post helpful.
  #10  
Old 07-17-2019, 11:37 AM
OBN's Avatar
OBN OBN is offline
OldCherryPicker
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Maryland
Posts: 8,669
Default Experience, ..........Still learning...

Originally Posted by cutaplug View post
3. Excellent depth capabilities. If it can reach the same depths of eq800 I would be happy with it.
4. Ability to set discrimination to eliminate zinc pennies and up. Iím not interested in digging silver or coins. Just looking for gold.

The CTX and Etrac are the best of the best for land hunting silver. Is there a detector that is equivalent for beach gold detecting?
Yet to be released,..........Fisher "AQ", if it does as said. then it's up to you to get your coil over the gold.

__________________
Blood Member of RingKeepers
2020......Gold Rings....51 .......Silvers ...47

Reply With Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
  #11  
Old 07-17-2019, 11:40 AM
KOB KOB is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 1,584
Default

Everyone here has very good valid points on finding gold on a beach. I spend alot of time on both California and Florida beaches. There is been much talk about a new detector on it's way that I'll call the "Ghost" detector. Ain't nobody going to see it. I have tried most all detectors out there. Currently own a modified PI machine that I've used forever and recently the Nox 800. They are different tools for different jobs. Your detector just doesn't exist yet and may never.

Through my research , on the beach , you pretty much have to dig everything. Though not an expert on the Nox yet , it does have it's place. Mainly in heavy trash infested areas. Like Felix said , I'm spending way too much time looking at a screen. I'm all about speed and volume. That's the game. I could have dug 3 targets on my PI instead of deciding on whether to dig 1 on the Nox. Though I do dig more trash , most times it's worth it and it goes deeper. The downside is it beats me up as I get older. Both machines weigh about the same with modifications. I will ALWAYS dig short double beeps that others pass up. That's with both machines. Bottle caps... well.. your just screwed on basically any machine due to depth , mineralization , etc. They can read like a 12 gram gold ring at 18 inches.

What beach and what the conditions are will determine which detector I will use. I hope 1 day I will see a detector that can only pick up gold and not pull tabs. But probably not in my lifetime. And when they do , they will have already found a way to artificially create gold !

Good luck and happy hunting !
Reply With Quote


3 members found this post helpful.
  #12  
Old 07-17-2019, 01:04 PM
ScubaDetective's Avatar
ScubaDetective ScubaDetective is offline
Freshwater Shark
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Underwater with the fishes
Posts: 11,886
Default

WHO cares if you waste a little time scooping bottle tops? Sorry I do not. A machine that does all your work is still going to miss gold. Sinkers are non ferrous. So are aluminum tabs. You also have brass in that picture.
NOTHING will discriminate out everything but gold. Nothing

__________________
Please leave a ring after the beep, Thank you
Fisher CZ-21 (3), Fisher CZ-20, Tesoro Tiger Shark (2), Whites Dual Field, Minelab Equinox 800 (2), Whites Eagle SL2 Find me on Facebook Scuba Detective

Reply With Quote


  #13  
Old 07-17-2019, 01:43 PM
Bklein Bklein is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 273
Default

I find the CTX VID worthwhile and the EQ800ís useless. You canít mask anything out with the EQ but can with the CTX. A PI will get you more depth but you will dig way more junk. So the easiest to use for me is the CTX for now (with a harness though). The AQ does sound like what you/we want but you have to wait. The gold that matters will hit on all the discussed detectors so use the one you like most. Test your detector on gold targets and if you donít find any on your site just believe itís not there and enjoy the day. Where do you hunt most - in the water or out? Iím more out and thus my CTX has not gotten soaked yet. SoCal beaches I hunt donít favor in water hunting except for extreme low tides.
Reply With Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
  #14  
Old 07-17-2019, 02:44 PM
Beachhunter's Avatar
Beachhunter Beachhunter is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Southern California
Posts: 2,120
Default

Yep! SoCal water with wave action can be brutal.

__________________
Equinox 800 / XP Deus

Reply With Quote


  #15  
Old 07-17-2019, 03:11 PM
zeemang zeemang is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: South of there
Posts: 19,971
Default

This advice only applies to IN THE WATER, salt water in my case

Excal II will fit your bill but you have to put the time in for your ears to distinguish targets, no screen.
I ran my excal for years and got better and better with it, at first it was frustrating and I thought pulltabs sounded like coins and vice versa. I dug TONS of pulltabs but rarely a nasty bottlecap with my excal. With the excal i ran on zero disc, but that still means you will not hit ferrous targets unless you are in pinpoint/all metal. I never raised my disc higher than the minimum. Your ears will be the disc... You WILL find tiny pieces of aluminum with the excal and it will sound good, no way around that...
After years and hundreds of hours I came to recognize the different tones. Low low can be stainless steel, the tab from inside a can(beaver tail), can slaw, foil or gold. The two that sound amazing are beaver tails, can slaw and gold, VERY distinctive. I can tell you by sound a stainless ring or some other nice sounding low tone.
I too currently run an equinox 800 and have the same feelings as you, bottlecaps sound awesome and DO NOT always drop to negative numbers when you swing over them. Gold can be ALL OVER THE PLACE as far as the readings you can get from 2 way up to the 30's. I was out in the water with my equinox this very morning, look at the numbers and you have no idea what you are digging and the sounds are not much help either even though I have taken the time to set up different sound bins and tones and volumes per slot. Bottom line with the equinox is fine, it will get you in the salt water with a fairly stable machine BUT you get what you pay for...
I will be selling my equinox as soon as I get some more money together to go back to an excal, there just is not comparison in my opinion.
Please note I was very careful to say "I was able to do this" and not everyone will be able to do this right out of the box. These things take time to learn...
If you can try to go to a dealer or find someone who has an excal and go armed with different things to wave under the coil and try to distinguish between the tones. If you can then maybe it is the machine for you!

__________________
E trac and an Excal II woowhoo!
Living the American dream, just a bit further south...


Last edited by zeemang; 07-17-2019 at 03:48 PM.
Reply With Quote


3 members found this post helpful.
  #16  
Old 07-17-2019, 03:44 PM
hikingthehills's Avatar
hikingthehills hikingthehills is offline
Full Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: GA
Posts: 188
Default

Iím doing freshwater with an Atpro but the posters above are right, you have to dig the trash to get the treasure. I found this gold ring which is small but still gold last Saturday. It barely chirped but I was able to get it to chirp 3-4 times. I figured it was a small piece of foil. Glad I dug it. Also check out the Videos of the equinox 800 on gold chains. Itís on YouTube. That will be the next machine I get.
Attached Images
 
Reply With Quote


  #17  
Old 07-17-2019, 04:25 PM
dewcon's Avatar
dewcon dewcon is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Gulf, Florida
Posts: 7,723
Default

Im not experienced enough to give advice on this subject....... since you seem to be looking for a machine that finds gold easily. If you cant make the CTX and Nox find gold ..... you are pretty limited at that point for salt water. Ive not had a beach machine yet that hasnt paid for its self several times over. The salt water is a real equalizer for all these machines..... they just loose depth and sensitivity. The Nox..... has the advantage out of the water for gold plain and simple.

__________________
MDT 8000, EQ800 CTX Blue Xcals

Dew Meeker


Last edited by dewcon; 07-17-2019 at 04:48 PM.
Reply With Quote


  #18  
Old 07-17-2019, 05:30 PM
Slimpickuns's Avatar
Slimpickuns Slimpickuns is online now
Supporter
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,952
Default

I get plenty of gold at the beach with my dinosaur Sovereign GT, haven't felt a need to switch to any other beach capable detector in 9 years...I have added a Surf PI to my arsenal though for those "Extreme" black sand beaches..

IMO once you have any beach wet sand capable detector, the rest is learning your machine and learning the beaches..

__________________
Minelab Sovereign GT, 10X12 SEF Coil, Jolly Roger Head Phones, RTG 6" Aluminum Pro Scoop W/SS Tip.

Reply With Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
  #19  
Old 07-17-2019, 06:12 PM
Tom_in_CA's Avatar
Tom_in_CA Tom_in_CA is online now
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 11,820
Default

Originally Posted by Slimpickuns View post
I get plenty of gold at the beach with my dinosaur Sovereign GT, haven't felt a need to switch to any other beach capable detector in 9 years...I have added a Surf PI to my arsenal though for those "Extreme" black sand beaches..

IMO once you have any beach wet sand capable detector, the rest is learning your machine and learning the beaches..
Good post. Machines like the excal, sov. Etrac, CTX, etc.... will find all gold, except earring studs, and dainty chains. A person can admittedly get a pulse so as not to miss the dainty gold, but the "devil is in the details" : Then he lacks the ability to pass iron. And let's be totally honest: If it's just melt value we're talking about, who the heck cares about micro-jewelry anyhow ?

I know some pulse guys will say they've figured out the iron-sounds. Ie.: they pass certain sounds. And I have no doubt they cut-down on nails. But I'll bet you dollars to donuts that .... in passing certain sounds, they will likewise pass an elongated bracelet as well. Doh!

Or you can get the 800, which touts iron-rejection WHILE retaining ability on conductive teensy stuff. But there's been some chit-chat about how you have to dumb down (ie.: program in the salt-reject #'s) when on the wet salt sand. So .... while I admit it's an improvement over the Sov, CTX, etc... , yet .... you will miss some dainty micro-jewelry on the wet salt, even with the 800.

I also agree with you on having a pulse as a back-up unit, on rare days where mother nature's storm erosion has left jet-black pockets. I've seen some zones like that (though rare) after storms here. And even seen where silver coins are right on top of the ground, where I can barely get a peep off of them. In those situations, I would have LOVED to have had a pulse, to see what I'm missing.
Reply With Quote


  #20  
Old 07-17-2019, 06:22 PM
itsaring!'s Avatar
itsaring! itsaring! is offline
24K Larry
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Dirty South
Posts: 13,445
Default

I use an EQ 800, excals, CTX, CZ21, DFX, etc. If you think a CTX can't find gold, don't look at most my old posts when i used to post some of my gold finds. It's still my favorite beach machine for wet and dry sand. I just don't get it wet anymore. That's why i have 4 excaliburs

__________________
In the battle of Thermopylae the Persian Armies demanded that the Greeks surrender their weapons. King Leonidas responded saying "Molon Labe." Translation "Come and get it".

Reply With Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:11 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.