Legal to search for property markers for someone?

Bonesquat

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A neighbor wants to pay me to locate their property markers in a modern neighborhood. There are tons of cops in this neighborhood. Somewhere I heard it was illegal to locate one with a detector. Sounds like crap to me, any truth to that?

Thanks
 
AFAIK, it's illegal to move or tamper with them. I see no reason why you couldn't find them with an MD.
 
A neighbor wants to pay me to locate their property markers in a modern neighborhood. There are tons of cops in this neighborhood. Somewhere I heard it was illegal to locate one with a detector. Sounds like crap to me, any truth to that?
Thanks

The only legal issue I can think of is that you are not a surveyor so to if you wanted to thoroughly CYA one would issue a liability waiver for them to sign off on that says so, and that your services are to find any markers in the expected area, and that you are in no way surveying or professionally staking out the property.

But I wouldn't do that I would just verbal express something along those lines, and that you are just finding what you an the owner believe are the markers. I would look around to make sure there are not multiple makers in the same corner too.
 
I've been asked numerous times to locate property markers, never received any money though. I usually go to our auditors web site and it has ariel phots with the lot lines marked. It's very accurate, saves me some time in locating them. I use a spade shovel and push in at an angle to hit the pins. Also I don't think anyone can say anything because your on private property with the landowners permission. Good Luck and HH... Tom
 
I loan out my BH to neighbors and 95% of the time they're trying to locate property markers.....they repay the favor by plowing my driveway and sidewalk in the winter!!

Dusty
 
Go for it, but ask the property owner to sign a piece of paper that you have the right to be on their property to locate existing lot corner pins.

You are not setting any or digging them up, just locating them. And if a policeman questions you, whip that paper on them! And tell them to go talk to the property owner, if he/she is not outside with you at the time.

I have done this a couple of times for friends. Usually there were some wooden stakes or markers nearby but the actual pin was below grade (ground level) a couple of inches...usually a quick easy find.

If you were to go to Harbor Freight, buy their yellow vest with the reflective stripes and wear a white hard hat, the policeman would probably never pay you any notice cause you look official! :lol::lol::lol:
 
If you were to go to Harbor Freight, buy their yellow vest with the reflective stripes and wear a white hard hat, the policeman would probably never pay you any notice cause you look official! :lol::lol::lol:

Those items are actually on my purchase list. There may be a time when a construction site may actually require those items if the big bossman lets me on the property.
 
Go for it, but ask the property owner to sign a piece of paper that you have the right to be on their property to locate existing lot corner pins.

You are nuts and obsessed with CYA with unneeded documentation. I would probably never get any permission to detect in writing. Just another barrier to getting a yes.


if a policeman questions you, whip that paper on them! And tell them to go talk to the property owner, if he/she is not outside with you at the time.

I have done this a couple of times for friends. Usually there were some wooden stakes or markers nearby but the actual pin was below grade (ground level) a couple of inches...usually a quick easy find.

If you were to go to Harbor Freight, buy their yellow vest with the reflective stripes and wear a white hard hat, the policeman would probably never pay you any notice cause you look official! :lol::lol::lol:

So you ask your friends to sign a note saying it is ok? Crazy.

Good point about the pin being below grade. Bonesquat and I tried the vest thing last hunt, and boy it increased the looks and drive-bys, but no one said a word to us.

My father in law thought it was hilarious! I told him jokingly if they arrested me for impersonating a utility worker on the TV Show Cops I would just start singing "Wichita Lineman" by Glen Campbell, and if that does work while they are driving away somehow I will poke my head out a window and do an encore of Rhinestone Cowboy!
 
You are nuts and obsessed with CYA with unneeded documentation. I would probably never get any permission to detect in writing. Just another barrier to getting a yes.




So you ask your friends to sign a note saying it is ok? Crazy.

Good point about the pin being below grade. Bonesquat and I tried the vest thing last hunt, and boy it increased the looks and drive-bys, but no one said a word to us.

My father in law thought it was hilarious! I told him jokingly if they arrested me for impersonating a utility worker on the TV Show Cops I would just start singing "Wichita Lineman" by Glen Campbell, and if that does work while they are driving away somehow I will poke my head out a window and do an encore of Rhinestone Cowboy!

Well you have your right to your opinion, and I got mine. But I disagree!

So someone on my block asks me to come down and detect their property corners...and I reply....at my convenience I will be happy to, but right now I am busy. Then when I show up at my convenience, they are not at home. Without that piece of paper, the police have every right to ask me what the heck I am doing on that property...Do you live here? With that little piece of paper, my A$$ is covered! Plain and simple. Doing a favor for a neighbor. Sooooo, unless I KNOW the neighbor is gonna be home, they are gonna give me that paper or no go.

And by the way, I am NOT obsessed with it! I happen to work for the government and understand my state's Trespassing laws. Without permission....and how to do you prove that to a third party..the cop...if not in writing...then it is an automatic $500 fine!
 
Well you have your right to your opinion, and I got mine. But I disagree!

So someone on my block asks me to come down and detect their property corners...and I reply....at my convenience I will be happy to, but right now I am busy. Then when I show up at my convenience, they are not at home. Without that piece of paper, the police have every right to ask me what the heck I am doing on that property...Do you live here? With that little piece of paper, my A$$ is covered! Plain and simple. Doing a favor for a neighbor. Sooooo, unless I KNOW the neighbor is gonna be home, they are gonna give me that paper or no go.

And by the way, I am NOT obsessed with it! I happen to work for the government and understand my state's Trespassing laws. Without permission....and how to do you prove that to a third party..the cop...if not in writing...then it is an automatic $500 fine!

In my state the police can not do a thing without the land owner filing a complaint. Private property is just that. The police have no powers unless they see a crime and stay off private property unless the complaint from the owner gets called in. If a neighbor calls them, they are powerless unless you are causing a crime. Metal detecting is NOT a crime. The owner has to call them and at worst a trespass ticket would be issued. You don't need to prove anything to a cop except the property is private and not city or county owned. Be aware that the curbs within about 4 feet of the road are city/county owned as an easement. If you are on the curb then the owners permission is not valid since it is not his property and a note in your pocket is meaningless.
 
Those items are actually on my purchase list. There may be a time when a construction site may actually require those items if the big bossman lets me on the property.

i wear my chartruse colored saftey vest when on curb strips or next to the roads. if a cop tries to give me any flack about impersonating a city employee, i'm just going to tell him its purely for saftey, and i am not responsible for anyone's erroneous assumptions :yes:
 
I happen to work for the government and understand my state's Trespassing laws. Without permission....and how to do you prove that to a third party..the cop...if not in writing...then it is an automatic $500 fine!

What are you too lazy to get it notarized?

Exactly like I thought, an IRS agent obsessed with paperwork! LOL!

That is a ridiculous enforcement of trespassing laws. "Prove you are innocent or we will fine you." Where do you live again? Arkansas, Russia? Nazi Germany? "Where are your papers?" "I have to see your papers!!!" "PAPERS!!!!!" anal retentive, and then some. Most places, and I am pretty sure Ark is one of them can't or won't prosecute unless it is posted "No Tresspassing" or you have been told not to be there and you keep coming back. I would think the worst that would happen is they would ask you to leave, after reading your law below. There is no way for them to prove you were there without permission. Next time I am at a friend's house and he goes out for beer I better get it in writing that I can be there LOL!!!

Law Quote said:
Criminal Trespassing
Under Arkansas Statute 5-39-203, criminal trespassing occurs when a person unlawfully enters either someone's property or vehicle. Such an offense is a Class C misdemeanor. However, the crime is considered a Class B misdemeanor, which is more severe, if the vehicle is used as a residence, such as a motor home or RV, or the property is or could be lived in.

Additionally, according to 5-39-305, a person can also commit criminal trespassing in vacant or undeveloped land located just outside a town or city boundary line. If the land is designed for crops or is surrounded by fencing, a person can only enter with the owner's written consent. Any violation is a Class C misdemeanor, unless the land is clearly marked with 'Keep Out' or 'No Trespassing' signs. In that case, the trespass is a Class B misdemeanor. (Reference 4)

Punishment
If a person is found guilty of criminal trespassing as a Class C misdemeanor, he may face up to 30 days in jail. A court may also order a fine in addition to the jail sentence. As of July 1, 2009, the maximum fine for a Class C misdemeanor was raised from $100 to $500.

If the trespass is a Class B misdemeanor, a guilty person faces up to 90 days in jail. The maximum fine also increased on July 1, 2009, going from $500 to $1,000.

Defenses
Arkansas' code does include several defenses to criminal trespassing. If a person can prove one of the defenses permitted under 5-39-305(c), he will be found not guilty. Applicable defenses include: the accused was the owner's invited guest, with permission to be on the property; the property was public land or private land open for public use; the accused was on the property to conduct legitimate business or to protect public health or public safety; or the accused entered the land accidentally and was not aware he was trespassing.
Read more: Criminal Trespassing Laws in Arkansas | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/list_6597315_criminal-trespassing-laws-arkansas.html#ixzz1XO4kbK00

i wear my chartruse colored saftey vest when on curb strips or next to the roads. if a cop tries to give me any flack about impersonating a city employee, i'm just going to tell him its purely for saftey, and i am not responsible for anyone's erroneous assumptions :yes:
Just start singing Wichita Lineman by Glen Campbell!!! Seriously you have every right to wear a safety vest. I have one too. Those cars can come close.
 
I think Tabdog would tell you to be careful about finding someone's property markers. If the property owner is going to locate a fence, shed, swimming pool, driveway, etc. based on your locating the markers, I would refer him to a licensed land surveyor. What you think is a marker could just be a random piece of buried rebar. A relative of mine had a dispute over a property line with a neighbor. The relative hired a licensed surveyor who located the property line. The neighbor was satisfied with the survey, even though it came out in my relative's favor. I don't think a guy with a metal detector would have satisfied him.
 
In my state the police can not do a thing without the land owner filing a complaint. Private property is just that. The police have no powers unless they see a crime and stay off private property unless the complaint from the owner gets called in. If a neighbor calls them, they are powerless unless you are causing a crime. Metal detecting is NOT a crime. The owner has to call them and at worst a trespass ticket would be issued. You don't need to prove anything to a cop except the property is private and not city or county owned. Be aware that the curbs within about 4 feet of the road are city/county owned as an easement. If you are on the curb then the owners permission is not valid since it is not his property and a note in your pocket is meaningless.

exactly
 
If the property owner is going to locate a fence, shed, swimming pool, driveway, etc. based on your locating the markers, I would refer him to a licensed land surveyor.

In that case you need to consider where the easements are. If you locate improvements on an easement appraisers will exclude them from estimates.
 
Seems to me that searching for a marker in private land is fine, as long as you have permission. And therein lies the problem. Since the owner doesn't know where that marker is (or he wouldn't have asked you to find it), you may very well cross the line into a neighbor's property (to the side, or behind) during your search. There could be up to four different property owners involved. If that's the case, you may need to get permission from all of them to be on the safe side.
 
Seems to me that searching for a marker in private land is fine, as long as you have permission. And therein lies the problem. Since the owner doesn't know where that marker is (or he wouldn't have asked you to find it), you may very well cross the line into a neighbor's property (to the side, or behind) during your search. There could be up to four different property owners involved. If that's the case, you may need to get permission from all of them to be on the safe side.

I think you should obtain permission from all adjoing property owners I would want to know why someone is on or near my boundries.

Ridiculous. Just do it! Or you could just spend your life getting paper work done...

Get notarized permission from all neighbors, all law enforcement heads, the mayor, the clergy, all the neighborhood children, then go run it by the city and county building inspectors just in case...

Who else can we ask?
 
I'm sure that every state has their own laws, but here in Missouri, if you are asked by the land owner to help them, you won't get in trouble. I have only had to look for property markers one time. There was a new subdivision put in and those little metal flags were stuck in the ground where the pins were put. Anyway, the landscaper send some kid in to mow the empty lots to keep the subdivision looking good. He pulled all of the of the markers thinking he would be able to remember where they were at...WRONG.

I didn't get paid as I did it as a favor, but I did get permission to hunt one homesite in town for two days before a demolition team came in and tore the house down to build a small apartment building. I was also given permission to hunt future development lands of his if I wanted to.

Doug
 
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