Bank owned property?

Krakken · Mar 12, 2012

So I have done some research on the county auditor website for a large empty lot about two blocks from my house. There was a house on the lot that was build in the 1930s but is no longer there. It turns out that a bank owns the property.

There is a local realtor's sign posted near the curb, but not much else, and there aren't any fences, gates, or "No Trespassing" signs anywhere on the property.

Would you consider this property fair game for metal detecting? Or should I call the realtor or bank first?

I would feel awkward about calling a bank or realtor.

SandInToes · Mar 12, 2012

I had a similar situation with a lot that used to be ball fields near me. I contacted the bank that owns it, and was denied permission to hunt the lot.

Let your conscience be your guide.

daddydigger · Mar 12, 2012

Use a backhoe to dig up the lot and offer to split the finds with the bank 80/20! If anyones asks, tell them you are filming a new reality show. Then remind them to step back because for some insane reason, a big explosion is coming and you need to run away!

Krakken · Mar 12, 2012

daddydigger said:
Use a backhoe to dig up the lot and offer to split the finds with the bank 80/20! If anyones asks, tell them you are filming a new reality show. Then remind them to step back because for some insane reason, a big explosion is coming and you need to run away!

I don't think they'll go for that. :lol:

ATLfun · Mar 12, 2012

Why do forum members entertain the idea of trespassing, even though it is not posted no trespass? The definition of trespassing is entering or remaining on someone′s property without permission. It is pretty straight forward. If it is posted then your are automatically guilty of trespassing without debate.

Without a sign, you might be given the benefit of the doubt if it is reasonable. Such as going beyond the boundary of a public park which is not clearly delineated. However in this case, you do not own the property and do not have permission, so it would be hard to argue that you were unaware that you were trespassing.

In addition to trespass, you would be guilty of theft by taking, if you removed items from the premises without the owners permission. When you purchase a property, you are purchasing a "bundle of rights." And those rights include keeping people off your property and from taking items from your property whether it be in your garage or minerals/coins in your yard.

It is red herring to suggest that somehow a bank owned property is similar to a public park. Without the banks permission, you are trespassing. If your ethical standard is whether you would get caught or not, then why don't you rob the bank instead.

Brian

Burbank Bob · Mar 12, 2012

I'd hunt a bank owned repo in a heart beat and if asked to leave, no problem.

Have a couple I'm considering that I saw this weekend. Old property too...

I can look REAL official .. hard hat, vest, and Sovzilla with the Yellow 180 meter mounted looks like some sort of radiation or leak detector..

"Yes Mam... I'm searching for decaying metal objects that may be contaminating the ground water"... :yes:

ATLfun · Mar 12, 2012

Burbank Bob said:
I can look REAL official .. hard hat, vest, and Sovzilla with the Yellow 180 meter mounted looks like some sort of radiation or leak detector..

"Yes Mam... I'm searching for decaying metal objects that may be contaminating the ground water"...

Anytime you feel the need to wear a costume to deceive people you are going down the wrong road. Property rights do not disappear because they are an inconvenience to you.

Why does this forum bother posting a code of ethics?

Brian

Krakken · Mar 12, 2012

ATLfun said:
Why do forum members entertain the idea of trespassing, even though it is not posted no trespass? The definition of trespassing is entering or remaining on someone′s property without permission. It is pretty straight forward. If it is posted then your are automatically guilty of trespassing without debate.

Without a sign, you might be given the benefit of the doubt if it is reasonable. Such as going beyond the boundary of a public park which is not clearly delineated. However in this case, you do not own the property and do not have permission, so it would be hard to argue that you were unaware that you were trespassing.

In addition to trespass, you would be guilty of theft by taking, if you removed items from the premises without the owners permission. When you purchase a property, you are purchasing a "bundle of rights." And those rights include keeping people off your property and from taking items from your property whether it be in your garage or minerals/coins in your yard.

It is red herring to suggest that somehow a bank owned property is similar to a public park. Without the banks permission, you are trespassing. If your ethical standard is whether you would get caught or not, then why don't you rob the bank instead.

Brian

Thank you for framing it the way you did. I will be calling the bank this afternoon.

I am not a law breaker, and I respect our metal detecting code of ethics. I have always gotten permission for private property, and this is no different. :hi5:

spacecoast · Mar 12, 2012

I think I'd be OK with hunting an unposted empty lot, I don't think there's any question that you're not there to vandalize or otherwise cause trouble. Please let us know how your conversation with the bank goes, I'll be surprised if they are amenable to your hunting.

daddydigger · Mar 12, 2012

Krakken said:
Thank you for framing it the way you did. I will be calling the bank this afternoon.

I am not a law breaker, and I respect our metal detecting code of ethics. I have always gotten permission for private property, and this is no different.

My advice is to NOT call the bank but go down there in person. It's just too easy to say no over the phone. Of course, if the bank is far away then you have no choice but to call. Either way, I hope it rolls your way and that lot gives up a bunch of silvers!

ATLfun · Mar 12, 2012

Hey Krakken,

You come across as a great guy, I was just blown away today by the number threads and posts that ignore property rights.

And yes, I agree with everybody who says that the bank will probably say "no" on the phone, just like a parks and rec. dept. will say "no" on the phone and nothing in the field. But that is different, because without posted rules, someone's interpretation of acceptable usage in a public park can differ.

I thought about hunting foreclosed properties when I was looking at my local bank's list of foreclosures last month. In addition to the private property thing here is what stopped me:

a. I work and hunt in the same city. I imagine it would not take a couple of run-ins with the police before the city became anti-metal detecting which benefits no one.

b. Neighbors always know the scoop on empty houses, so the liklihood of being reported is greater.

c. And they would be more likely to call the police, not the same as a park worker asking you to leave.

Having said all that, I am sure you would only be asked to leave. But what if the policeman wanted to file an incident report and let you off with a warning. Now you have a track record, which certainly is not a good thing. All you need is one "gung ho" cop to respond and what is your response going to be?

I will admit the one gray area, that I am thinking about testing out, is public lots without houses owned by the city. I have come across three adjoining lots that are being taxed as public property, the grass is cut, but the lot is not designated as a park, but no signage either about trespassing. They had houses on them from at least 1950 to 1980 according to historic aerial photos. I will make a run at those until I am told otherwise. But in this case, I am not knowingly entering private property that I do not own, and I do not require an invitation per se since it is public property.

Brian

RyanChappell · Mar 12, 2012

ATLfun said:
Why do forum members entertain the idea of trespassing, even though it is not posted no trespass? The definition of trespassing is entering or remaining on someone′s property without permission. It is pretty straight forward. If it is posted then your are automatically guilty of trespassing without debate....s similar to a public park. Without the banks permission, you are trespassing. If your ethical standard is whether you would get caught or not, then why don't you rob the bank instead. Brian

Why do forum members like me drive 9mph over the speed limit when it is clearly posted? lol

Property is usually posted no trespassing because they do not want people deer hunting on it, going inside abandon houses, or suing of injuries that occur on it. Do you think the Sandlot kids asked permission?

Use your discretion just like I do when speeding. Some states have stricter statues on tresspassing. The police would probably put a low priority on a call about someone metal detecting a vacant lot...especially in a area where they are more concerned about narcotic sales, murder, and prostitution... In a better neighborhood they may come right out.

Whether you get asked to leave depends on whether someone nosy sees you, and that can depend on the area. Come to think of it, it is usually a nosy neighbor that thinks that you are getting rich, and is jealous that asks you to leave without any authority. This happens in public places that you are allowed to detect as well.

Cover your holes and a reasonable amount of trash in addition to that you dig.

ATLfun · Mar 12, 2012

RyanChappell said:
Why do forum members like me drive 9mph over the speed limit when it is clearly posted? lol

Your "straw man" argument does not hide your lack of ethics and respect for the property rights of others. Speeding has as much to do with metal detecting, as speeding does to murder. You do not have the right to hunt the private property of others in the absence of permission.

You know that you do not have permission, yet that does not deter you. You rely on not being reported, or only be warned as justification for taking items from yards that you have no legal claim to. I would also refer you to the forum's Code of Ethics thread.

Brian

Burbank Bob · Mar 13, 2012

ATLfun said:
Anytime you feel the need to wear a costume to deceive people you are going down the wrong road. Property rights do not disappear because they are an inconvenience to you.

Why does this forum bother posting a code of ethics?

Brian

Hey Brian - it was a JOKE! (about the gear...) Humor... you know... funny? :roll:

Those that know me know I normally don't hunt in the dirt. You will too if you stick around that long and stop giving morality lessons to others.

Heck... you should apply for a Moderator Job.. pays big!

skeeterbait · Mar 13, 2012

I to had a same situation bank ownen property I called guy was all excited until I mentioned detecting they want no one on the property so I'm like ok ill find some place else no big deal no night hawking just leave it be end of story .

ATLfun · Mar 13, 2012

Burbank Bob said:
Hey Brian - it was a JOKE! (about the gear...) Humor... you know... funny?

You will too if you stick around that long and stop giving morality lessons to others.

No morality lessons, this is not a religious issue. There is a Code of Ethics posted at the top of the General Discussion section, and there are property rights that owners enjoy that are not subject to your approval.

Brian

TheCoilist · Mar 15, 2012

Here is an experiment for you:

If it's currently legal and unregulated to hunt public parks in your area, tot lots, etc. Give the city a call and 'ask permission'. I would like someone to seriously do this and report back what the city tells them.

I am almost willing to tell you that the person you talk to will have no idea what the law is, and whether or not it's allowed and will automatically say NO.

It's just an experiment. Same thing for the bank people. They have no idea and the properties manager or whoever is probably not the person who you'll be speaking with and may not even be at your local branch. They could be some corporate big wig in a penthouse suite somewhere and the chain of command breaks far far below his level.

Everything is owned by someone. In essence to pull your machine out, one should be asking permission regardless of where you go. Truth of the matter is, it's grey area any way you look at it.

Gib · Mar 15, 2012

outwardjourney said:
Here is an experiment for you:

If it's currently legal and unregulated to hunt public parks in your area, tot lots, etc. Give the city a call and 'ask permission'. I would like someone to seriously do this and report back what the city tells them.

I am almost willing to tell you that the person you talk to will have no idea what the law is, and whether or not it's allowed and will automatically say NO.

It's just an experiment. Same thing for the bank people. They have no idea and the properties manager or whoever is probably not the person who you'll be speaking with and may not even be at your local branch. They could be some corporate big wig in a penthouse suite somewhere and the chain of command breaks far far below his level.

Everything is owned by someone. In essence to pull your machine out, one should be asking permission regardless of where you go. Truth of the matter is, it's grey area any way you look at it.

You are comparing apples and oranges. Public property is not the same as private property, bank owned or not.

If you call a bank about detecting one of their properties, the answer is going to be no. There are liability issues.

Milhaus · Mar 16, 2012

Krakken you asked a question, and that's fine IMHO.

For the newbies and young people, or anyone who may have been banged on the head really hard at some point, do yourself a favor and don't trespass or sneak. Especially if you are planning to "remove" cash and items from property owned by a bank :laughing:

DirtyRob · Mar 16, 2012

I talked to some hunting buddies...deer and bird hunting....they hunt bank owned land all the time UNLESS it is posted "No Tresspassing". They have never had a problem with the banks or the DNR (Dept. of Natural Resources) Officers.

Bank owned property?

Krakken

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SandInToes

Senior Member

daddydigger

Krakken

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ATLfun

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Burbank Bob

ATLfun

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Krakken

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spacecoast

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daddydigger

ATLfun

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RyanChappell

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ATLfun

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Burbank Bob

skeeterbait

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ATLfun

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TheCoilist

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Gib

Milhaus

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DirtyRob

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