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  #1  
Old 04-03-2013, 06:10 PM
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DIGGER27 DIGGER27 is online now
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Default Tesoros, Tabs and other Trash....a novel

Idxpro is learning his Outlaw and asked a question about how to tell the difference between good targets and trash...specifically tabs, on another forum.
I have been making an effort to get as good as I pssibly can at doing exactly this for awhile now and I think I found something that works very well.
There are several techniques we can use to target types when using most Tesoro detectors and I know and use them all, but this one is the one that works the quickest for me with the highest degree of success and accuracy.

For the benefit of any newbies that have picked a no screen Tesoro as your first detector I would like to say good for you...learning to hunt by sound can only be helpful to you as you spend time in this hobby, and I hope this technique might come in handy and become as useful to you as it has for me if you decide to try it.

--------------------------------------------------

This is what I have learned about dealing with trash using Tesoro detectors.
I am usually a dig it all hunter but late last year I got real tired so for about a month I stopped doing so much of that and at the end of some long hunts do it still, and I have worked very hard at trying to figure out trash so those "what if" feelings don't drive me insane when I am in that kind of mood.
I think I might be a little crazy compared to others because so many try to avoid digging tons of trash and I seem to be the opposite where I love digging it and the trashier the site the better I like it.
Well, maybe not like so much as long ago I decided this is the best way to hunt...for me, and I do this for the exercise as much as finding treasure so there is that reason, too,
I suspect the real reason I got to this point is among all the trash signals I have dug I have also had some major surprises along the way...very huge and delightful surprises... and I just can't seem to wrap my head around the idea of ever missing anything good let alone great...so I dig and I am fine with it.
For those times when I just don't feel like digging every blasted thing I come across I have read about and use some well known tips others have posted like whipping the coil over a trash target quickly and noticing if it breaks up, or lifting the coil as I swing over a target and listening to see if it breaks up at the edge of the scanning field or just fades out, and these techniques work.
I have also done a lot of experimentation discovered something else.
On every target I come across, and I mean every one, I got in the habit long ago of NOT just turning that disc knob up till the signal fades out to see what area the knob is pointing to figure out target types like all the manuals say, but I always turn all the way past the area till the target fades out completely and then slowly turning down the knob to the point where the target comes in .
Except high tone targets like quarters that don't disc out, of course.
After several zillion targets acquired and dug I am convinced this is a much more accurate way to figure out just about every target.
I get so much more information out of not only seeing where that disc knob ends up when the signal is solid and full, but more importantly I get even more info when I hear precisely HOW that
target comes in.
I noticed that and most good targets like coins, definitely on others like rings that are full and not broken, and surprisingly on most chains too, when I turn down that knob most good targets will just "come in"...solid and full...there is very little crackling or fuzzyness in that signal most of the time, not even one or two clicks.
Trash on the other hand usually does have much more crackling and clicks in that signal before it firms up and I assume this is because most detectors are designed to home in on solid round objects like coins and not irregular shapes like trash or objects with holes like tabs.
Now this is not true 100% of the time because the universe and life just doesn't work this way for us in this hobby.
There are some trash targets that do act like good coin targets and will come in full and solid and with no clicks.
Some beaver tail tabs with that tail folded over, foil that is thick like a coin, compressed and formed into a round coin shape, some small coin shaped pieces of can slaw and even a few sta-tabs do fool me me from time to time because there is virtually no difference between some of these and a real coin signal.
If those kind of targets are laying completely horizontal and flat in the ground this can compound this problem, but luckily most trash is not horizontal but turned slightly on edge to almost vertical, in my experience, and react accordingly with much crackling and clicks.
Conversely, sometimes good targets like coins do act weird and have some fuzzyness and at least a few clicks before solidifying, too.
I noticed this happen on a few zinc pennies and nickels can be totally weird, sometimes.
Yesterday I was using my Compadre and dug a nickel that was a little iffy and didn't even disc out till close to the tab section, and another nickel that came in at the correct area on the disk knob but still acted very crackily just like trash.
Even though I was a little tired at this point and was not digging all trash I still dug both of these signals because I heard something in each signal that triggered my digging impulse...a slight solid tone that rang true even though they were very short nowhere near the very solid type signals that most good targets I dig emit.
Exactly why I dug those is hard to explain but I just chalk that up to an ability I have acquired over the hundreds and hundreds of hours swinging my Tesoros...something most Tesoro owners can attest to once they accumulate
enough time and experience in listening and learning the Tesoro language and quality of the tones.
The good thing about all this is that even though I do this thumbing knob thing on all targets to figure them out I also dig most targets too, and I can proudly say I have gotten good enough to correctly determine trash from treasure about 90% of the time.
On hunts where I don't dig every signal I still do check myself and dig many of the trashy ones throughout every hunt just to make sure...again those what if feelings will mess with my head and destroy me if I don't...and this is no matter how tired I am.
The best thing is my greatest targets I have found like gold rings, silver coins and silver bracelets and chains, this technique worked 100% on those type of targets every time.
Don't think this thumbing, listening figuring out thing takes a whole lot of time either.
I have had so much time in doing this and so much practice I have gotten extremely fast at it and usually beat out any and every hunting partner in shear volume of targets dug even though I take a few seconds to do this on every one, and still seem to hit those correct guesses somewhere around that 90% number most of the time.
I am not saying I never leave any good target in the ground doing it this way, after all if I never dug a trash sounding but still good target how would I ever know, but I can tell you that I have had a few hunts where I was avoiding digging as much trash as I could and still walked away from 2 in particular with a pretty empty trash pouch but a couple of really great treasures.
One was a nice silver necklace that came in as foil, and another which was a gold ring that also came in as a higher foil signal but below nickel.
Trash targets both in a site filled with other trash targets that came in at exactly the same positions as many trash signals at these sites and yet still sounded good, and more importantly met my criteria of coming in solid with very few if, any, clicks at all.
I read all posts on several forums about techniques using the Tesoro detectors and try to remember and use them when I need to, but I have not read many that talk exactly about this sort of technique of turning past the fade out point and back, or if they do at the very least using it as much as I do.
On my Compadre I know this works tremendously, on my Vaquero it seems to work just about as well, especially when using a concentric coil over my DD which has a slightly sharper disc ability.

I am assuming it will work on most Tesoro's including the Outlaw.
If you have a mind to please give it a try and let
me know if it works for you, too

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  #2  
Old 04-03-2013, 06:35 PM
Terry Soloman Terry Soloman is offline
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Great post! I totally agree!!
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Old 04-03-2013, 06:44 PM
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Digger here's one for you.I was out today with the Compadre working around the outside of a tennis court,was digging mostly clad all morning and a ton of trash,so decided to just cherry pick so i maxed out the disc.and just started looking for dimes and quarters.Well came across a solid signal and guess what it was?a dang penny,had me scratching my head trying to figure out this dang thing that was suppose to be disc,out came in.Anyways scanned the hole again and nothing else to be found,probed that sucker for 5 minutes trying to figure this out.
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Old 04-03-2013, 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted by richbat View post
Digger here's one for you.I was out today with the Compadre working around the outside of a tennis court,was digging mostly clad all morning and a ton of trash,so decided to just cherry pick so i maxed out the disc.and just started looking for dimes and quarters.Well came across a solid signal and guess what it was?a dang penny,had me scratching my head trying to figure out this dang thing that was suppose to be disc,out came in.Anyways scanned the hole again and nothing else to be found,probed that sucker for 5 minutes trying to figure this out.

I don't have a compadre, but y F2 will signal a dime when it's a COPPER penny sometimes. Maybe because a dime has some copper they ring alike?
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Old 04-03-2013, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by richbat View post
Digger here's one for you.I was out today with the Compadre working around the outside of a tennis court,was digging mostly clad all morning and a ton of trash,so decided to just cherry pick so i maxed out the disc.and just started looking for dimes and quarters.Well came across a solid signal and guess what it was?a dang penny,had me scratching my head trying to figure out this dang thing that was suppose to be disc,out came in.Anyways scanned the hole again and nothing else to be found,probed that sucker for 5 minutes trying to figure this out.

Check the date, it will be a copper penny from 1982 or before.
They sound and act like dimes and won't disc out.
This will hold true for all Lincoln head cents back to 1909.
When we jump to Indian heads, even they are mostly copper but they always come in as zinc signals.
Don't ask me why, I have no clue.
I have dug 2 of those with my Compadre, 3:00 on the disc knob exactly like zinc both times.

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  #6  
Old 04-03-2013, 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by OZARKS View post
I don't have a compadre, but y F2 will signal a dime when it's a COPPER penny sometimes. Maybe because a dime has some copper they ring alike?
The conductivity is close to the same for both of these, so the detector thinks and acts like they are similar.
On my F2 a copper penny is usually a 70-71, a dime is usually 73 but this does not hold true all the time.
I am actually starting to hear a difference in the tone between a dime and a copper penny on the F2.
A very, very slight difference...but it is there.

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Old 04-03-2013, 09:08 PM
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Thanks Digger was not aware of that,go figure been detecting for a number of years and never even new about that.LOL
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Old 04-03-2013, 11:21 PM
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Originally Posted by richbat View post
Thanks Digger was not aware of that,go figure been detecting for a number of years and never even new about that.LOL
Lots of hunters go a long time not realizing that there is a difference between some pennies.
I see posts from newbies all the time that are confused by this same thing.
I didn't for a while, but I finally got it.

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Old 04-03-2013, 11:48 PM
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but when you dig these foil signals, they are SOLID, right? i dig anything that isn't jumpy, for the most part. cool post!

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Old 04-04-2013, 02:47 AM
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Digger speaks the truth my friends. He was gracious enough to answer some PMs from me regarding how to learn my Compadre faster. What he wrote here was one of the gems he shared with me, and it made a huge difference. Digger, you might as well make this the first installment of a complete Compadre series! And then we can ask to make it a sticky. And then you can spend more time hunting!

Many thanks for sharing what you've learned.
Rich
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Old 04-04-2013, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Skwerly View post
but when you dig these foil signals, they are SOLID, right? i dig anything that isn't jumpy, for the most part. cool post!
On my Tesoros, there are no jumping numbers on a screen to tell you if you are swinging over trash, and by adjusting the disc knob you can usually dial most targets in so they sound nice and solid.
For that reason you have to use other techniques to figure things out and this is just one of them.
On a Tesoro the targets that crackle and spit and click before they become solid as I dial down would equate to jumpy numbers on an F2 screen just like most trash.
The solid signals that just "come in" with no fuzzyness would be the same as a solid, no jumping number on the F2...a good target.
Not 100% of the time, but mostly.
It takes me about the same amount of time to thumb that knob and make an educated guess as it does to swing over a target with my F2 a couple of times and watch the screen to see how the numbers act...it is that fast once you get some practice.

I am always amazed at people that don't own these detectors with no screens, and even more so at owners that have and use them that actually do think these are only "beep and dig" detectors with no information coming out of them to give you any clues at all.
That has never been true, the information is there...lots of it, but you just have to learn some techniques, the language, and get good at understanding that language.
It's not all that hard to get fluent in this kind of language...it's just different than metered and VDI machines, that's all.
Some people like Tabdog have become masters at this and can tell just as much if not more about hidden targets as those that swing detectors with screens.

Some guys do just get a beep and dig it, and I do dig a lot of trash even if I suspect it is trash if only to get it out of the way to see if it is masking something else which is rare, but happens.
Even if I dig most signals I still want to get good at making correct guesses on those targets which helps at times when I just want to only cherry pick the good ones.
Just a little game I play with myself on every target in order to hit goals I set for myself and as a gauge to see if I am still getting better at doing this stuff.

I post this kind of thing because I don't believe there is any manual out there from any Tesoro unit that says to do it this way.
They all tell you to "dial up" till the signal fades out, but I really believe this way is much better,
For me it is, anyway, and if I post it someone else might try it to see if it works for them, too....and I hope it does.

Learning never ends in this hobby as in life, and I try to learn new things on every hunt with all of my different detectors and always improve.
When you do learn something new and helpful that can be one of the greatest things about this hobby as far as I am concerned.

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Old 04-04-2013, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by samandnoah View post
Digger speaks the truth my friends. He was gracious enough to answer some PMs from me regarding how to learn my Compadre faster. What he wrote here was one of the gems he shared with me, and it made a huge difference. Digger, you might as well make this the first installment of a complete Compadre series! And then we can ask to make it a sticky. And then you can spend more time hunting!

Many thanks for sharing what you've learned.
Rich
You are very welcome and I hope all those tips helped.
The more you know and learn in this hobby the funner(?) things get.
Better targets seem to somehow come your way, also.

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Old 04-04-2013, 10:49 AM
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And then you do like I did and come across a small 10k gold ring standing on edge that only my Compadre picked up!
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Old 04-08-2013, 11:36 PM
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I bought a Compadre thinking I could tell the difference between good and trash targets. It's a great detector, but after testing different rings there are cases where the sound will break up even on a gold ring. There's a lot of variables at play including trash masking the target in which case digging it all would be the only solution. That's the only way you'll get everything and unlock the full potential of the machine.
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Old 04-08-2013, 11:50 PM
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I have to admit, will walk past 15-12's on the E-Trac all day. I dig nickels while avoiding beavertails with ease. After I'm done, I wonder how many gold rings I just walked over.
Often times to much info is to much info. Have to dig.
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Old 04-09-2013, 12:56 AM
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Originally Posted by MikeTX View post
I bought a Compadre thinking I could tell the difference between good and trash targets. It's a great detector, but after testing different rings there are cases where the sound will break up even on a gold ring. There's a lot of variables at play including trash masking the target in which case digging it all would be the only solution. That's the only way you'll get everything and unlock the full potential of the machine.
Same results here.
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Old 04-09-2013, 06:35 AM
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Originally Posted by MikeTX View post
I bought a Compadre thinking I could tell the difference between good and trash targets. It's a great detector, but after testing different rings there are cases where the sound will break up even on a gold ring. There's a lot of variables at play including trash masking the target in which case digging it all would be the only solution. That's the only way you'll get everything and unlock the full potential of the machine.
Air testing results and how targets react when it has been buried in the ground for awhile can be completely different.
Even if you bury targets, that new, freshly turned soil can have an effect.
All I know is on objects buried in the ground, and on every good target I have ever dug, this is the way they act most of the time.
Good targets have never broken up much before they come in, bad targets usually do.
Keep trying.
Maybe I am crazy, but in the field in the real world I actually do seem to hit that 90% number on figuring these signals out most of the time.

Still, I have always been a dig it all hunter, still do that 98% of the time and, like you, have recommended others think about doing that because unless you dig it you will never know.



The last real great target I dug doing this, the last golden one, was found last November.
I was at a new park for me and I had dug a ton using my Compadre.
Over $5 in clad and a huge amount of trash...close to 200 targets were dug, maybe more.
On most of the trash targets I knew it was trash, suspected it was, anyway, but I know about masking so I dug them anyway.
Near the end of this hunt I was real tired and I switched to this cherry picking method for about the last 1/2 hour I was there.
I was right next to a picnic pavilion, all kinds of targets were here, plenty of coins and also lots of trash like tabs and small foil and little bits of can slaw.
I had quit digging the trash at this point, the pieces that broke up when I dialed them in, that is, I was still digging anything that dialed in solid as I explained in the OP above.
Then I came across this target.

On big gold like class rings my Tesoros both emit a tone that is different than most.
I have been lucky enough to hear this tone a few times in my career and it made me stop in my tracks every time it is so distinct.
Hard to explain but it is sweeter, fuller, rings a little truer and maybe a bit longer.
That is the big stuff, on smaller gold I don't hear any difference and those sound like most other solid targets to me...so far.

On this target it dialed in right at the L in foil, no clicks, no fuzzyness, it was just...there.
I still thought it was a piece of trash, just something that acted like a good signal like a small piece of can slaw laying flat in the ground or a piece of foil that was not irregular shaped so it acted like a coin.
Most of the time that is what these signals will be, coming in solid or not.
Gold is a very rare find out there for us dirt hunters, but still it happens and I have found enough to get excited on every odd signal, every target that comes in solid on my Tesoros from zinc on down and every odd number I have ever seen on my F2 screen.
That is why I do this and why I dig all that trash...I just love surprises and I have had my share.
On this one I was pretty sure it was a piece of trash but it met my requirements for digging and even though I was dead tired at this point I spent a little of the energy I had left bending over and digging it hoping and wishing it was gold like I have been disappointed doing so many times before.

You know what?
Sometimes wishes do come true.

http://metaldetectingforum.com/showthread.php?t=132026


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Old 05-11-2013, 09:41 AM
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Nice description of your technique, I am reading and absorbing... 8" should arrive to me Monday

And nice find on the pot leaf adorned gold band!

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Old 05-12-2013, 06:13 AM
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Great post Digger! Thanks!

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Old 05-13-2013, 07:33 PM
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Digger, your posts (books) are always interesting, informative, and darn enjoyable read, I can't help but search for them every chance I get.


Thank you for Sharing.

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