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Old 07-11-2017, 01:19 PM
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Default signs, private vs public, innocuous vs not innocuous, etc...

Here's a humorous true story to shed light on the "signs" versus "private property" versus "trespassing" versus "permission" and "innocuous" versus "not innocuous" issue:

Upon reaching retirement age, and man & wife decided to do the typical senior citizens thing: Get an RV, travel the country. See the sites, visit the relatives, etc... They sought to learn all they could about the tricks of the trade. Eg.: join an RV travel club, buy a membership at KOA, and so forth.

As they were preparing for their first road trip, the man talked to another long-time RV enthusiast. The long-timer explained that sometimes, if you find yourself where there's no KOA or RV hookups, you can just pull into any Kmart parking lot at night. And just stay self-contained for those nights. The long-timer explained that Kmarts are always centrally located to easy freeway access. They are usually well lit, clean, safe, etc...

So the man and wife took off on their trek. And as one night approached, they realized that they were in a part of a state where they had no parks or KOA's on their list. The man remembered what his mentor had said about "Kmart".

As they approached the next city's limits, the man could see coming up the big familiar Kmart sign. He exits and pulls into the lot. And sure enough, he sees another RV or two at the remote ends of the lot. Parked, Wheels chalked, blinds drawn, awnings up. Clearly prepared to stay for the night. So he thought "aha. So it's true: RV's do indeed park @ K-mart lots for the night". So he chose a spot in the hithermost end of the lot, to prepare to park for the night.

Since it was still about 10 minutes before the 9pm closing time, he decided to go into the store to buy a few things. And as he approached the exit, he could see a man with a "manger" pin waiting to close the doors after the last customers. So he asked the manager: "Is it ok if I park our RV here for the night ?". The manager replied: "No, this is private property". To which the RV'r pointed out the door and across the lot and says "Oh ... well I saw they were parking there". The manager glances out at the far-away RV's, shrugs his shoulders, and says: "They didn't ask".

The man and wife therefore left to look for some other place to park. Took their chances on some other sidestreet somewhere. The next morning, as they return to get on the freeway, they pass by the Kmart. And see their fellow RV's milling around their RVs, never having been bothered.
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Old 07-11-2017, 01:24 PM
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I had to chuckle when I read that story. Because I happen to own a street sweeper business. And for many years we had routes of shopping centers, where our little vacuum trucks would clean each night.

And yes, it was not uncommon for someone to be parked (RV or car) snoozing away. We just ignored them and they ignored us.

About the ONLY time I brought a particular RV to a manager's attention, was one that was seemingly PERMANENTLY parked. All the time, in the same spot. And it was quite apparent they were living there. (litter, a dog in a little fenced dog run pen, etc...). Only then did I ever see a property manager actually care or go to evict anyone from over-night parking. It was just a non-issue (bigger fish to fry), than to scrutinize any vehicle parked after hours every night. To squabble over customer vs non-customer, occupied vehicle vs. non-occupied, blah blah. So unless it was something of a nuisance, it was typically ignored.
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Old 07-12-2017, 10:08 AM
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I find the whole concept of property ownership/trespassing an interesting historical study/debate...Seems the basic parameters are all about who has the stronger enforcement hand...Besides basic trespassing, Lots of places around here have other 'laws' in place...No Smoking on the beach, No alcohol allowed in the Park, No dogs, No weapons....yet we Detectorists are witnesses to countless prolific infractions of rule disobedience...

Its a strange thing...I had a place on the river here, I posted it 'No Trespassing'...half heartedly on account of its the PERFECT camp spot and people have been camping here for a long time before I showed up..my Grandfather even told me how they would camp out on this spot way back when they were kids! ....I was not down there all the time to enforce "My" property rights" Nor did it bother me in the least little bit if somebody disregarded my signs and camped out there and enjoyed the place....Nothing a guy could do about it anyway...Nobody owns nothing unless they can defend it...

Anywhoo...I guess the deal is, a guy doesnt always have to ask for permission...but you gotta be ready to run or debate or apologize or get arrested if a 'stronger hand' who owns the place shows up hopping mad and not so historically minded....Think about all the trespassing on Farmers lands that occurred during the Civil War?

Just saying...its easier to go through Life unbothered, and that depends on how many people you involve in asking things.. In fact, if somebody came and detected in my Front yard without asking, I would not give one tinkers Cuss! I dont really own this place anyway...the Bank and The Tax assessor do! Both way much stronger hands than mine, and besides, most likely I'd be down on the beach detecting and smoking anyway...!
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Detecting is the study of Mankinds interaction with topography, the untrustworthiness of pockets, and metals desire to return to the Earth from whence it came.

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