A find: One of life's mysteries? (Updated 26th July 2019)

Doug · Jun 4, 2019

Out and about in local fields with a find that my first impression was it would easy to get an ID for it..............I was wrong.

More on the find further down in this post.

Thanks for looking.............Doug.

Queen Victoria 'bun' penny 1863.

Jetton surface find.

Hack(scrap) silver top left, possible to be used to buy things.

2nd/4th century Roman coins and brooch.

2nd/3rd century complete Roman brooch.

Silver spoon hallmarks.

"Jetons or jettons are tokens or coin-like medals produced across Europe from the 13th through the 17th centuries.

They were produced as counters for use in calculation on a counting board, a lined board similar to an abacus.

They also found use as a money substitute in games, similar to modern casino chips or poker chips."

Artefact came from a field that produces a fair amount of Roman coins and artefacts. I had never seen anything like it before so I sent a photograph to the FLO (Finds Liaison Officer) at the local museum.

Her suggestion was a Roman lamp holder with just part of one on record but was waiting validation. (means that there is not other one to compare it with)

My thoughts were it was over engineered to be a simple lamp holder so now I have agreed to hand it it to the museum for further investigation.

sandgroper · Jun 4, 2019

Awesome finds as usual.

I think the system in England where you have finds liaison officers and that you report significant finds is pretty good. It promotes the hobby, and you can get things properly ID'd (and I suppose it's quite cool to have something you found in a museum).

metaladdict · Jun 4, 2019

Wow, a whole roman brooch thing!
I like the silver coins!

Waveoff · Jun 4, 2019

Congrats on the great finds! And, as always, excellent background information on said finds. :yes:

HDMontana · Jun 4, 2019

Very cool finds. Congrats.

HD

GroundSweeper · Jun 4, 2019

Man Doug, you find some serious goodies, and post awesome posts! I enjoy them, thank you, and congrats on the great amazing finds!

SeabeeRon · Jun 4, 2019

That complete broach is amazing! Also, waiting to see what the “hook” thingy turns out to be! Could be a one of a kind find! :wow:

Doug · Jun 6, 2019

sandgroper said:
Awesome finds as usual.

I think the system in England where you have finds liaison officers and that you report significant finds is pretty good. It promotes the hobby, and you can get things properly ID'd (and I suppose it's quite cool to have something you found in a museum).

Thank you.

Our PAS and FLO system (Portable Antiquities System/Find Liaison Officer) England and Wales works on trust although for certain items there are several laws on the statute books for reporting certain items the rest are voluntary.

metaladdict said:
Wow, a whole roman brooch thing!
I like the silver coins!

Thank you.

Waveoff said:
Congrats on the great finds! And, as always, excellent background information on said finds.

Thank you.

HDMontana said:
Very cool finds. Congrats.

HD

Thank you.

GroundSweeper said:
Man Doug, you find some serious goodies, and post awesome posts! I enjoy them, thank you, and congrats on the great amazing finds!

Thank you

SeabeeRon said:
That complete broach is amazing! Also, waiting to see what the “hook” thingy turns out to be! Could be a one of a kind find!

Thank you.

I have found 4 such items on the internet. Part of one one on the finds database, another part of one on a well known auction site and a complete one on a commercial ancient art site, link below.

I also found one on a photograph showing Roman medical instruments, bottom right in the photograph.

Complete one here:

https://www.ancient-art.co.uk/roman...MNSnkinEY0UC392oIMZ0VhF4CTcn2Z11njUYM9UrARHWE

SeabeeRon · Jun 6, 2019

With that link and the Roman Medical Instruments pix, I think you IDed it!!

Doug · Jul 26, 2019

Today I had a meeting with the FLO (Finds Liaison Officer) to receive her report on the Roman hook I found in May this year.

On the initial meeting her suggestion was the hook was for hanging an oil lamp in Roman times.

My thoughts was it was over engineered to be a simple lamp holder and I did find reference to a medical instrument of the Roman period it being the same shape.

The problem that both the FLO and I had was we could not find any written or photographic evidence to substantiate my claim that it was not a simple hook but was made for a specific task.

Until an item of the same design and of the same period that can be found which gives the hook another purpose or use it's been classified to being a 'Lamp Hook'.

Last paragraph in the report makes takes note of my suggestion it is not just a simple hook.

Report here:-

https://finds.org.uk/database/artefacts/record/id/963115

SeabeeRon · Jul 26, 2019

Thanks for the update Doug!!

It struck me as interesting that the Finds Liaison Officer is a woman and the position if referred to as "FLO". :cool3:

ToySoldier · Jul 26, 2019

Doug said:
Today I had a meeting with the FLO (Finds Liaison Officer) to receive her report on the Roman hook I found in May this year.

On the initial meeting her suggestion was the hook was for hanging an oil lamp in Roman times.......

Somebody might have misidentified the object as a medical device. I'd be curious how the collection of tools was compiled. Piece by piece based on some other documentation of what would have been in a medical kit, or was it found in the equivalent of a doctor's bag or office?

Come to think of it, A good light source is and was critical for medical procedures, so it might be wise for a doctor to carry a lamp cleaning/hanging device that is sturdy, multifunctional, and fits in a bag. There are a lot of different ways one could hang a lantern with that device. It would be as much a "medical device" as the more recently obsolete head mirror.

On the other hand, wouldn't tools made for maintaining lamps come up more often and have more examples today?

cellrdwellr · Jul 26, 2019

Great post and finds Doug, congrats! Thanks for the fun read and photo's!

Skippy SH13 · Jul 26, 2019

Doug said:
Out and about in local fields with a find that my first impression was it would easy to get an ID for it..............I was wrong.

More on the find further down in this post.

Thanks for looking.............Doug.

Queen Victoria 'bun' penny 1863.

Jetton surface find.

Hack(scrap) silver top left, possible to be used to buy things.

2nd/4th century Roman coins and brooch.

2nd/3rd century complete Roman brooch.

Silver spoon hallmarks.

"Jetons or jettons are tokens or coin-like medals produced across Europe from the 13th through the 17th centuries.

They were produced as counters for use in calculation on a counting board, a lined board similar to an abacus.

They also found use as a money substitute in games, similar to modern casino chips or poker chips."

Artefact came from a field that produces a fair amount of Roman coins and artefacts. I had never seen anything like it before so I sent a photograph to the FLO (Finds Liaison Officer) at the local museum.

Her suggestion was a Roman lamp holder with just part of one on record but was waiting validation. (means that there is not other one to compare it with)

My thoughts were it was over engineered to be a simple lamp holder so now I have agreed to hand it it to the museum for further investigation.

I just drool when I see these kinds of finds. Oldest stuff around here is usually from 1960. LOL

Skippy

A find: One of life's mysteries? (Updated 26th July 2019)

Doug

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sandgroper

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metaladdict

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Waveoff

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HDMontana

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GroundSweeper

SeabeeRon

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Doug

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SeabeeRon

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Doug

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SeabeeRon

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ToySoldier

cellrdwellr

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Skippy SH13

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