An old story that bears repeating :

LandOLincoln said:

.... What do you think scubas take of this would be?

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Haha, yes, he and I have "sparred" over this. But he's in a slightly different aspect/type of the hobby. Unlike a park, where you can merely walk away, come back later, and .... likely not bump into the same person twice. Scuba, on the other hand..... is a lot more time-investment , gear to lug around, etc..... Not like the kind of thing where you can just come back at ... uh ... "more opportune" times when a singular kill-joy is gone.

In his case, I guess he had no choice, because the person he was sparring with, was watching this exact zone like a hawk.

Yes, there are times when ... we must fight. But in my 40+ yrs. of this, I've come to conclude that with md'ing, it should be a tactic done VERY SPARINGLY !! Because, let's be dreadfully honest: Detectors *do* have some connotations. Hence sometimes the LESS attention and scrutiny to us, is better. Ie.: the less some pencil-pusher thinks of you and I, the better.

Hehe i had to ask. Unfortunately the conatations with medal detecting had to come from somewhere, which is why I questioned the original story, really I just want to know the "whole" story behind why metal detecting was actually banned in wherever these state parks are from the story. Which brings to mind just recently I was at my LCS where a younger woman was selling a sizable amount of old coins morgans/mercs/buffs/vnickles/barbers and the like. I asked if she was a collector and she said no, she was just helping her family member who became ill and needed the money to sell her coins. I asked if she still lived in her house and if it was old, reason being i metal detect and would love to hunt the property and would split the finds. She said its funny you ask because she swears she buried a huge stash of silver coins a long time ago, but they had let someone detect the yard and they dug up the whole yard looking for them and said no. I was heartbroken. But I do agree with you about being low key, and sometimes plan my hunts accordingly. I prefer weekdays and mornings while everyone is at work. Also our park district has a picture id permit card for hunting in parks but I have never been bothered by leo while detecting, rockford has much bigger problems. Thanks for helping my day go a little quicker with a good story and something to think about, HH Tom

In PA, they even have nearly entire cities off limits, like the state archies can take over huge areas not even owned by state. But think the state parks vary, all, part or no area off limits, depending on historical events/people. Local historical societies can be a factor.

I think the seize your stuff applies to National/Federal parks like Gettysburg.

In many cities the main detecting worry is crime. PA has some parks out in the country that are beautiful and some can be detected. Then there's also private property with permission.

Harrisburg can be detected except the capital grounds that have a park-like yard extending out 2-3 blocks from the building. Last I heard Fairmount Park in Philadelphia said no detecting within a few hundred feet of the 1700s millionaires mansions. Not sure if still correct.

I'd also like you stay away from anywhere that says fish & wildlife refuge.

Hope you can still find many good places. George (MN)

remmy said:

I stay well clear of Pennsylvania state parks and game lands! I have heard horror stories that if you are caught breaking the law on those grounds, they can fine you AND seize your equipment. Some say they even have the right to seize the vehicle you drove there (not sure I believe that) but it does not seem worth the risk.

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Most people who live near you won't even detect Rockford parks because of the crime. In your area some nearby towns are safer and old enough for silver. I know Rockford parks even suggested detecting there back in the late '70s.

As for myself, I try to use parks when others are using them, rather than leave myself as the only one around if someone is having a bad day. It can be advantageous to detect in a small group, I think, for less chance of getting kicked out. Best wishes.

LandOLincoln said:

I guess i just dont understand what we should be taking from these stories. Whats the principal of the story?

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George (MN) said:

....
I'd also like you stay away from anywhere that says fish & wildlife refuge.
....

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George, I can totally understand if/when archies want to keep us away from obvious historic sensitive monuments. Ok, that makes sense. And I can totally understand if someone thinks we'll leave marks in nicely manicured turf. Ok, that makes sense (just go at lower traffic times). But what I DON'T UNDERSTAND is your comment on "fish & wildlife refuges".

It can make sense if it were historical. It would make sense if we were talking manicured turf. But please oh please oh please tell me how-the-heck "fish & wildlife" landscapes are going to be bothered by a metal detector ?? Will it harm the fishies ? OF COURSE NOT. Will it harm the wildlife ? OF COURSE NOT . So .... what is the rationale ?

LandOLincoln said:

I guess i just dont understand what we should be taking from these stories. Whats the principal of the story?

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Heres the Lesson: It applies to any and all Outdoor Pursuit Oriented Sports....

"Its a Big Wonderful World out there, your participation Time on it is Short, dont think too much, avoid Humans"....

I was approached by a police officer in a park that I had been to many many times. He did offer the information that "someone called". I asked him if it would look better (because the caller may be watching) if I left immediately. He said yes. I asked him if I should never return, he said to consider who can see me in that area of the park (from their home) and avoid the area but it is a big park. Wink, nod....the point here is that if someone calls, they are likely watching from their window as the valiant police officer runs you off. If you leave it makes it look good for everyone. It did not seem to me that the cop thought I was wrong at all, just wanted to make a show for the busy body that called. I have been at that park many times since with no issues. There are only 2 houses that can clearly see a small area (where I was) in that park, I just don't go there.

remmy said:

I was approached by a police officer in a park that I had been to many many times. He did offer the information that "someone called". I asked him if it would look better (because the caller may be watching) if I left immediately. He said yes. I asked him if I should never return, he said to consider who can see me in that area of the park (from their home) and avoid the area but it is a big park. Wink, nod....the point here is that if someone calls, they are likely watching from their window as the valiant police officer runs you off. If you leave it makes it look good for everyone. It did not seem to me that the cop thought I was wrong at all, just wanted to make a show for the busy body that called. I have been at that park many times since with no issues. There are only 2 houses that can clearly see a small area (where I was) in that park, I just don't go there.

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Same here! Theres a whole lot of folks with nothing to do but look out their windows and report 'suspicious behavior'...thats their only form of entertainment...its tragic when you think about it......

remmy said:

I was approached by a police officer in a park that I had been to many many times. He did offer the information that "someone called". I asked him if it would look better (because the caller may be watching) if I left immediately. He said yes. I asked him if I should never return, he said to consider who can see me in that area of the park (from their home) and avoid the area but it is a big park. Wink, nod....the point here is that if someone calls, they are likely watching from their window as the valiant police officer runs you off. If you leave it makes it look good for everyone. It did not seem to me that the cop thought I was wrong at all, just wanted to make a show for the busy body that called. I have been at that park many times since with no issues. There are only 2 houses that can clearly see a small area (where I was) in that park, I just don't go there.

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I love your post !! Same thing happened to me one time in San Francisco, CA. I got "scrammed" by a policeman. But .... after some casual conversation, he confided that he was just there responding to a callout from a certain ... uh .... "lookie-lou" in the area. And that this busy-body seemed to always make it her business to call the cops anytime something strange goes on in the park by her house. And ... trust me ... in San Francisco, there can be some ... uh .... STRANGE THINGS that go on in parks. Ie.: a self-appointed park-monitor.

Thus the cop suggested to me that I simply go to the other side of the park. A few blocks away, and resume my md'ing there. The entire time he's "wink-winking" me, glancing over his shoulder, to indicate the particular high-rise window/building of the "miss-lookie-lou".

If I had not engaged this cop in this friendly chit-chat, and if I'd just "tucked my tail and left", I would probably be thinking "oh no, md'ing in SF parks is illegal" (hard to argue with an eviction by a cop , eh ? Need to "get this clarified", right ?) But as you can see, these things can often be a cop just responding to a dispatch. And then ... they need to justify their just having-been called out. And ... presto, the knee-jerk connotation is "holes". So ... gee, ... they boot you.

And ironically, my wife is the worst offender of this sort : We lived across the street from a community park for several years. And she became involved in a "community watch" type network. Because, admittedly, sometimes teenagers would come to this park to have keg parties. Or other type riff-raff that exceeded the sundown time-line. (heaven forbid). And she enjoyed nothing more than being a vigilante . So that our neighborhood remained on the "up & up". haha

So-too-, when an isolated "scram" or question comes, I do not construe such encounters as being "must seek clarification" or "must rush to city hall to confirm" type conclusions. Sometimes it merely means: "Avoid that one individual".

Hey Tom,
I have another positive story. One time a construction site near downtown uncovered an 1800s dump. I mean bottles were just sitting on top of the ground. About 30-40 of us from our club were either out there detecting or collecting bottles. One day when I wasn't there they were out there doing their thing when a city worker tried to run them off on the basis of liability and if we hurt ourselves the city didn't want to get sued. Well, when my fellow club members showed them what they were doing and what they were finding he quickly became a friend and stayed longer working the machines scraping more layers of dirt to help them find more stuff.

I met him at our next club meeting and they made him a lifetime member. I think he got the bug now and I haven't been as involved in the club since then so I don't know if we still have his inside information for construction work....lol

Sometimes these things work out in our favor if we just play it cool.

GL & HH
Brian


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

ThriceChex said:

Hey Tom,
I have another positive story. One time a construction site near downtown uncovered an 1800s dump. I mean bottles were just sitting on top of the ground. About 30-40 of us from our club were either out there detecting or collecting bottles. One day when I wasn't there they were out there doing their thing when a city worker tried to run them off on the basis of liability and if we hurt ourselves the city didn't want to get sued. Well, when my fellow club members showed them what they were doing and what they were finding he quickly became a friend and stayed longer working the machines scraping more layers of dirt to help them find more stuff.

I met him at our next club meeting and they made him a lifetime member. I think he got the bug now and I haven't been as involved in the club since then so I don't know if we still have his inside information for construction work....lol

Sometimes these things work out in our favor if we just play it cool.

GL & HH
Brian


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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Good story. Yes that is a tactic to get "in's" ... is to get the person (landowner or whomever) amped about the finds. So that they become equally curious. Heck, I've even loaned them a spare machine from my truck at times, haha

Also notice from your story an interesting possibility: It is very possible that if you guys had gone to city hall seeking permission, that your question would be bandied about from desk to desk, then have to go before city counsel for a vote, then have to go past legal dept. for approval, blah blah blah. And then guess what the answer would most likely have been ? Yet as your story shows, .... it worked out.

This happened in my city, where the high school, blt. in 1919, got all the inner court grass ripped out, for rennovation work. Our club knew the project was upcoming, so we had sent a request letter to the school district to "get permission".

Meanwhile, a local md'r, who didn't happen to be in recent club meetings, had just ... uh ... helped himself. He was getting handfuls of silver ! I spotted him inside the project, and went out to see who it was, and what he was finding. As we were talking, an after school janitor came out of one of the unaffected buildings, and was taking a look at my friend's daily finds. Then wished him luck, and went back in the building. THAT WAS ALL I COULD TAKE !! I went back to my truck, fetched my machine, and joined John in the silver fest.

A few days later, I fetched the mail for our club's P.O. Box, and could see a letter with the return address of the school district offices. Took it to the club meeting, and read it aloud: "We are sorry to inform you that we can't grant permission. Thank you very much, blah blah. ".

I vowed never again to let that happen

Tom_in_CA said:

George, I can totally understand if/when archies want to keep us away from obvious historic sensitive monuments. Ok, that makes sense. And I can totally understand if someone thinks we'll leave marks in nicely manicured turf. Ok, that makes sense (just go at lower traffic times). But what I DON'T UNDERSTAND is your comment on "fish & wildlife refuges".

It can make sense if it were historical. It would make sense if we were talking manicured turf. But please oh please oh please tell me how-the-heck "fish & wildlife" landscapes are going to be bothered by a metal detector ?? Will it harm the fishies ? OF COURSE NOT. Will it harm the wildlife ? OF COURSE NOT . So .... what is the rationale ?

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Sometimes, fish and wildlife refuges are located near virtual ghost towns they want to take over. Or the area was used by prehistoric Indians. And the name fish and wildlife just seems to suggest any people are unwelcome except a few govt types who "work" there. Not parks, obviously.

This is why big government sucks.

nostalgia083 said:

This is why big government sucks.

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They only "suck" when you make yourself a giant bullseye, in need of their pressing attention. If you don't beg them for that attention, then ... no ... they don't suck.

Tom_in_CA said:

They only "suck" when you make yourself a giant bullseye, in need of their pressing attention. If you don't beg them for that attention, then ... no ... they don't suck.

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Um, no. Big government does suck because big government means less freedom. Individual liberties, unalienable Creator endowed rights are a threat to big government. It's why our founding fathers fought Britain due to the government out of control. Government exists to serve a specific purpose and it's not to control and dictate our lives as if we are its children.

You're in California, a Socialist state. I feel sorry for you.

nostalgia083 said:

Um, no. Big government does suck.....

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When it comes to md'ing issues: Yes. Which is why: The less they think of me/you : The better.

But when it comes to building roads, providing infrastructure, utilities, police, when-you're-getting robbed, etc.. then .... No, they don't suck.

nostalgia083 said:

Um, no. Big government does suck because big government means less freedom. Individual liberties, unalienable Creator endowed rights are a threat to big government. It's why our founding fathers fought Britain due to the government out of control. Government exists to serve a specific purpose and it's not to control and dictate our lives as if we are its children.

You're in California, a Socialist state. I feel sorry for you.

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Very true and yes it does need repeating and often.

That being said, we do try to avoid politics here on the forum. Me personally, I find nothing upsetting or offensive about this and doubt many others here on the forum would either. In fact, if the American's here can't agree on this, regardless of political beliefs, we are really in sad shape. I hope the thread stays but that is a decision someone else has to make.