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  #1  
Old 04-01-2020, 08:57 AM
graybeard graybeard is offline
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Smile Negative ground balance for Minelab detectors?

Do you set a higher number or lower number to get a negative ground balance on the Equinox and X-Terra detectors? I have read with the X-Terra if it balances at a higher number it means the ground is more neutral.
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  #2  
Old 04-01-2020, 11:10 AM
jmaclen jmaclen is offline
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That is the way I understand it graybeard. My Deus and Racer 2 ground balance in the high 80s to mid 90s. My Equinox ground balances between -2 and +7, my former XT 705 was 2 to 9. Ground mineralization and ground phase are two different readings but they do have a relationship.

Jeff

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Old 04-01-2020, 12:06 PM
tnsharpshooter tnsharpshooter is offline
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EQX is backwards to most other detectors. Milder is lower. Like 0.
Deus is 90.
Etrac who knows it works.
CtX same thing.

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  #4  
Old 04-01-2020, 12:19 PM
Donut Donut is offline
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On Xterra the higher the number the more minerals are in the soil. Same for the Equinox.

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  #5  
Old 04-01-2020, 02:14 PM
jmaclen jmaclen is offline
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Originally Posted by Donut View post
On Xterra the higher the number the more minerals are in the soil. Same for the Equinox.

I have to disagree with you TNSS and Donut. The dirt in the areas where I detected with a Deus, F19, F75 have all registered moderate to high mineralization with the Deus mineralization bar 2/3 to 3/4 full and the F19 and F75 at up to 4 bars. So, amount of mineralization is not always reflected by ground phase numbers. I have very low ground phase numbers on my X-Terra and Equinox but have moderate to high mineralization according to detectors with mineralization graphs.

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  #6  
Old 04-01-2020, 02:21 PM
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tinsmith tinsmith is offline
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On the Xterra 705 the low ground phase numbers mean high mineralization and high GP number is low. According to the Xterra handbook by field tester Randy Horton the Xterras were made to read backwards for some reason. Where low reads high minerals and high low. Randy considers Ground phase number 28 to be middle. Under 28 he recommends using DD coils. I have always used GB tracking when I hold the GB button it reads the Ground phase number, my areas are most often in the teens and low 20's. If in a newer, filled, landscaped park it'll read higher like 30's and 40's. Higher in clean newer fill denoting low minerals. I always let the detector do the work and use GB tracking. I've never set it manually.

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Old 04-01-2020, 06:39 PM
tnsharpshooter tnsharpshooter is offline
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Originally Posted by jmaclen View post
I have to disagree with you TNSS and Donut. The dirt in the areas where I detected with a Deus, F19, F75 have all registered moderate to high mineralization with the Deus mineralization bar 2/3 to 3/4 full and the F19 and F75 at up to 4 bars. So, amount of mineralization is not always reflected by ground phase numbers. I have very low ground phase numbers on my X-Terra and Equinox but have moderate to high mineralization according to detectors with mineralization graphs.

Jeff
Okay to disagree.
How about this.
If EQX balances with 0 in the meter, high odds ground is not highly mineralized. Zero is the default setting btw.
Eqx is backwards than Deus.
Odds are higher mineralization Eqx reads higher and Deus reads lower. Default GB for Deus is 88 or 90 depending on version you run.

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Last edited by tnsharpshooter; 04-02-2020 at 07:52 AM.
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  #8  
Old 04-02-2020, 08:00 AM
graybeard graybeard is offline
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The post is not about balance numbers, it is about setting the detectors to negative from ground balance. The Equinox and X-Terra detectors have been out there long enough that I figured someone would know how to set for a negative balance. I ask Minelab in the U.S. and so far they haven't answered my question.

So if they are like most detectors, I will have to ground balance them, then slowly raise and lower them as I adjust the + and - on them to see. If when I lower the detector and get more sound then it will be on the positive side. If I get more sound when I raise the detector that will be on the negative side, and that will be what I am looking for.
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  #9  
Old 04-02-2020, 02:13 PM
MuddyMo MuddyMo is online now
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Originally Posted by graybeard View post
The post is not about balance numbers, it is about setting the detectors to negative from ground balance. The Equinox and X-Terra detectors have been out there long enough that I figured someone would know how to set for a negative balance. I ask Minelab in the U.S. and so far they haven't answered my question.

So if they are like most detectors, I will have to ground balance them, then slowly raise and lower them as I adjust the + and - on them to see. If when I lower the detector and get more sound then it will be on the positive side. If I get more sound when I raise the detector that will be on the negative side, and that will be what I am looking for.
I asked a similar question and about setting tracking offset negatively. I can't remember who it was that answered and it was a detailed anwer but it only confused me. I then tried what you said above and found this out.
Lower than ground balance numbers gave a lower sound while lifting the coil up and down. Higher than ground balance numbers gave a higher tone while lifting and lower coil. So I assumed and very possibly incorrectly that lowering the numbers will give a negative gb. When you figure it out, and about offset, let us know!
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Old 04-02-2020, 03:26 PM
jmaclen jmaclen is offline
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Originally Posted by graybeard View post
The post is not about balance numbers, it is about setting the detectors to negative from ground balance. The Equinox and X-Terra detectors have been out there long enough that I figured someone would know how to set for a negative balance. I ask Minelab in the U.S. and so far they haven't answered my question.

So if they are like most detectors, I will have to ground balance them, then slowly raise and lower them as I adjust the + and - on them to see. If when I lower the detector and get more sound then it will be on the positive side. If I get more sound when I raise the detector that will be on the negative side, and that will be what I am looking for.
Sorry graybeard, I did not completely understand your original question. This is from the manual. It kind of answers you question.

Manual Ground Balance
Ground Balance can be manually adjusted until the minimum amount of ground signal is heard.
1. Press the Settings button to navigate to the Ground Balance setting in the Settings Menu.
2. Raise and lower the coil repeatedly over a clear patch of soil that does not contain any targets.
Listen to the audio response to interpret the result of the Ground Balance; a low tone indicates that you should increase the Ground Balance value and a high tone indicates that you should decrease it.
3. Press the Minus () and Plus (+) buttons to manually change the Ground Balance value until the minimum amount of ground signal is heard. The Manual Ground Balance value is shown on the Target ID Display.



Jeff

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  #11  
Old 04-03-2020, 04:34 PM
Monte Monte is offline
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Originally Posted by graybeard View post
Do you set a higher number or lower number to get a negative ground balance on the Equinox and X-Terra detectors? I have read with the X-Terra if it balances at a higher number it means the ground is more neutral.
'graybeard', please pardon my tardy reply, but Jeff, 'jmaclen', gave you the correct answer.

I don't know about how MInelab messes around with Ground Balance on other models, but I do know I wish I had GB capability on my two Vanquish 540's.

You asked specifically about the X-Terra series, and my handling of them goes back to their earliest introduction when they contacted me and provided an X-Terra 30 (factory preset) and X-Terra 50 which offered Ground Balance. I was then sent an X-Terra 70 when they were about ready and I preferred the X-Terra 70 over the X-Terra 50 for a few reasons, mainly because I could better fine-tune the GB compared with the X-T 50. The newer 505 and 705 are just some slightly changed models from their earlier siblings, and when I helped a Dealer friend of mine, who is a big Minelab Dealer, I did a lot of explaining and demonstrations for people to help them learn the 'backwards' Ground Balance of the X-Terra series.

With most detectors on the market, be it a Fisher F75 or F-19, Garrett AT Gold or AT Max, Makro Racer 2, Nokta FORS CoRe or Relic, Nokta / Makro Impact or Anfibio Multi, Teknetics T2 or Omega 8000, White's MXT Pro or MX-7, XP Deus or ORX, and the list could go on and on .... they produce a numeric Ground Phase read-out to reference the level of challenging ground mineralization. The higher the mineralization, the larger or greater the numeric read-out.

Most of the brands have a 'default' GB setting that is for higher mineralized environment, but the operator can use Automated GB or Manual GB and fine tune it for their search site. XP Deus and ORX have a high-mineralized default setting of '88' or '90.' The Nokta / Makro models, Teknetics T2 and some other also use a default GB of '90, while models like White's MXT Pro uses a default GB of '83.'

\Most of the places I hunt in Oregon, Nevada, Utah and a few other western states are rather mineralized and tha functional GB setting might run anywhere from '78', which is in he upper-end of the moderate ground mineral rang, up to '85' to '88' which is a higher-mineralized setting. So you'll note the higher mineralized ground is close to or just very slightly less than their default GB setting.

I also do some Coin Hunting in some urban environment s that have a moderate level of mineralization and the non-Minelab models will then reflect a GB read-out in the '40s' to maybe the mid-to-upper '60s'.

Thus, with MOST makes and models of metal detectors that use a numeric read-out, the lower the number, adjusting to the smaller numeric reading, signifies a lower mineralization level. If the GB number is a much larger number, the bigger or higher reading number, that's an indication the mineralization level is also a greater amount you are dealing with.

The X-Terra series, and perhaps the Equinox which I haven't manually tinkered with, are just the opposite. When I got my Minelab X0-Terra 50, I noticed right away it was goofy because I was living in one of the very mineralized areas, and the majority of my detectors feature manual GB control, although some also have an Automated (bob the search coil technique) Ground Balance.

When it arrived I did some quick indoor evaluations with some test samples and playing with the Manual GB I set it at about '20'if I recall. Then I headed over to a renovation site and local park and checked the detector's response and using Pinpoint and just analyzing, it nulled out as I lowered the search coils from about 4" down to an inch of the ground. What does that suggest? That the GB was too negative and I needed to increase the GB setting.

With a 'normal' detector what would you do? Increase the control clockwise or to a higher (numbered) setting to increase the GB to make it more positive. I did that, by increasing the GB to a larger number, but the result was a more negative GB setting! I then recued the numeric read-out for the GB, adjusting to a smaller or lower numerical number and checked as I worked my way down. The GB for that mineralized site was '12.'

So I learned right then the day I got the X-Terra 50, and later the '70' and later used the '705,' that Minelab has a backwards way of doing some things. The smaller the number, the more positive or more mineralized the ground, and the larger then number, the less mineralized the ground.

Both the Equinox 800 and X-Terra 705 Owner Manuals do a very poor job of describing Ground Balance or make a correct reference to what is positive or negative.

Sorry for the long reply, but if you're using an X-Terra and GB close to 'spot-on' but want to manually adjust to a slightly Negative setting, then select a larger or increased number. Example: If you have an Automated GB setting of let's say '18' and you want to adjust for a slightly Negative GB, just increase the GB number to '19' or '20' but do not over-compensate.

Monte

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  #12  
Old 04-04-2020, 06:35 AM
graybeard graybeard is offline
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Thanks Monte for your reply. With most detectors showing numbers you lower the number for a negative ground balance. Minelab does a terrible job of explaining things in their manuals.
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