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  #1  
Old 12-31-2016, 08:57 PM
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Default Pulltabs @ 10 Inches

I'm digging pulltabs at 10 inches in old areas where old silver has been found, yet very rarely at that depth. Many tectors have hunted there and I've put in tons of hours there myself but never pulled a 10" silver there. Some of the Minelab guys have popped some. My Whites can get a simple pulltab, why not a coin at the same depth?

My question is, since I have the ability to detect multiple pulltabs at this depth, is there any reason that a pulltab reads and is found this deep whereas silver nor even clad, gets pulled?

It just seems odd.
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  #2  
Old 12-31-2016, 09:01 PM
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Sounds like the soil has been turned over to me. If you are getting silver shallower than that, that's what I would think it is.

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Old 12-31-2016, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Marjam42 View post
Sounds like the soil has been turned over to me. If you are getting silver shallower than that, that's what I would think it is.

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+1 sounds like there may have been dirt moved around by big machinery.

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  #4  
Old 12-31-2016, 09:15 PM
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Clad should have logically been turned over along with the pulltabs though, and silver has been found that deep by a few, just not by my machine. Pulltabs seem to light right up. I'd love to find even Memorials or a clad quarter at 10 like these pulltabs produce. A tiny rusty nail is understandable with the halo. This is nagging at me.
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Old 12-31-2016, 09:49 PM
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thats interesting Ive dug 9 inch tabs with my machine and silvers that deep too . I suggest you bury a silver coin and pull tab at 10 inchs and run your machine over it and see what happens.

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Old 12-31-2016, 10:07 PM
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Well Martin,,,
Be honest,,just how many 10" deep dimes have you dug with your White V3i detector???

How are the mineral levels on the site???

Minelabs definitely handle EMI better than V3i,, based on my experiences.

Oh,,and these 10" pull tabs you are digging,,how do they ID???

That multi freq on Minelab,,,,a killer for depth on average vs more typical vlfs.

What denomination silver coins were the ML folks a digging,,,dimes I'll bet.

And wonder what the coin orientation is of the silver the ML folks dig?? On edge or partially,,,again multi freq better on IMO.

The program(s) in those FBS/fbs2 love disc shape and higher conductor.

Wonder how many 10" deep pull tabs the ML folks have dug??
I'll guess,,none!!

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  #7  
Old 01-02-2017, 07:31 PM
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Hiya Martin, I can help you out in the Etrac department. I cant guarantee silver but I have some productive areas we can hit. You have seen my swing, I sweep pretty fast looking for those cherries left behind by the previous poster. Yesterday I was at Whiterock testing my new coil...the 6x8SEF. That makes the comparison fairly even. That coil will separate VERY WELL.
I pulled a rosie from 8" between two pulltabs in about a 4 inch area. That tells me I have no doubt missed many a coin by rushing through "cherry picking". Send me a pm and we can set up a hunt .
Cheers and Happy New Year!

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Old 01-02-2017, 08:43 PM
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Default My AT Pro finds coins at 10" inches.

I would say change up your coils and settings. Some times you can overload a coil and only get 5 inch depth. I know it sounds wrong, but I find deeper stuff at lower settings with my F75. The AT Pro will hit at 10 Inches all day with a 5x8 coil. Pull tabs would definitely hit at that depth. I always wonder what I am missing, and usually find stuff if the weather changes. Your v3i is no slouch and Im sure you know how to use it. I just suggest trying to fool your machine some days. As mentioned beofre you could be dealing with all sorts of ground disturbances.

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  #9  
Old 01-03-2017, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Trix View post
Hiya Martin, I can help you out in the Etrac department. I cant guarantee silver but I have some productive areas we can hit. You have seen my swing, I sweep pretty fast looking for those cherries left behind by the previous poster. Yesterday I was at Whiterock testing my new coil...the 6x8SEF. That makes the comparison fairly even. That coil will separate VERY WELL.
I pulled a rosie from 8" between two pulltabs in about a 4 inch area. That tells me I have no doubt missed many a coin by rushing through "cherry picking". Send me a pm and we can set up a hunt .
Cheers and Happy New Year!
Thanks TRIX! I will PM you.
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Old 01-03-2017, 01:55 PM
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Martin,
Keep us posted on your results alongside your new it looks like hunting buddy.

My brother uses a V3i,,he could use some help too.
I will pass along your findings to him.

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Old 01-03-2017, 03:28 PM
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I wont worry about digging deep into hard ground since you carry a hip mounted backhoe..😄

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  #12  
Old 01-09-2017, 09:17 PM
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We did get out today but Martin now has an Explorer SE Pro and wanted to learn the Minelab language. Similar to Etrac but VDI is different. I gifted him the Andy Sabisch book (its a must have) and now he has a wealth of knowledge. Mostly clad with around 20 memorials, 5 or 6 rosies a couple quarters and each with a wheat (1917 &1921). Enough for a training day. Nice to just get out. Windy but in the 60s. Maybe more tomorrow. Cheers.
I recall some deep holes but cant say anything came out ftom 10 ".

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Old 01-09-2017, 10:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Martin_V3i View post
I'm digging pulltabs at 10 inches in old areas where old silver has been found, yet very rarely at that depth. Many tectors have hunted there and I've put in tons of hours there myself but never pulled a 10" silver there. Some of the Minelab guys have popped some. My Whites can get a simple pulltab, why not a coin at the same depth?

My question is, since I have the ability to detect multiple pulltabs at this depth, is there any reason that a pulltab reads and is found this deep whereas silver nor even clad, gets pulled?

It just seems odd.
So I'll throw my 2cents in here, but this in just an opinion I have based on my experiences.

I don't think detectors respond to all metals the same, while I usually Disc out much of the nickels/tabs/gold 50-75% of the time, I 've noticed with both the V3i & the Etrac, pennies always seem to come back with a more solid identifiable signal than silver at deeper depths. Since I generally discriminate out most the tabs I haven't really compared the intensity of a deep aluminum signal to a deep silver signal, but I too have Dug deep tabs, which is why I get tired and discriminate them out

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Old 01-09-2017, 11:06 PM
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I too run a tightly modified screen, the tabs are in there but just barely. Etrac excels at hittting the conductives and playing a sweet "silver warble".I chase the high co's lurking in all those tabs. Its more like wiggling than swinging. But I can only do that for a short time and then I am pressing on. Its those squashed screwcaps that sucker me the most.

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Old 01-09-2017, 11:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Trix View post
I too run a tightly modified screen, the tabs are in there but just barely. Etrac excels at hittting the conductives and playing a sweet "silver warble".I chase the high co's lurking in all those tabs. Its more like wiggling than swinging. But I can only do that for a short time and then I am pressing on. Its those squashed screwcaps that sucker me the most.
And purex lids,,zinc can lids,,copper washers.

But thank God,,,,FBS doesn't like bottle caps.

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  #16  
Old 01-10-2017, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Big Treble View post
So I'll throw my 2cents in here, but this in just an opinion I have based on my experiences.

I don't think detectors respond to all metals the same, while I usually Disc out much of the nickels/tabs/gold 50-75% of the time, I 've noticed with both the V3i & the Etrac, pennies always seem to come back with a more solid identifiable signal than silver at deeper depths. Since I generally discriminate out most the tabs I haven't really compared the intensity of a deep aluminum signal to a deep silver signal, but I too have Dug deep tabs, which is why I get tired and discriminate them out
All detectors working at the same operating frequency will respond to metal the same. How a metal response is based upon conductivity, surface area, thickness, orientation in the ground, temperature, and ... Frequency. It is the laws of physics. No detector can violate them.

What is different is how a detector will receive and process the target information. Receive coil sensitivity, ground balancing, digital signal processing, operating frequency/frequencies - these are what matters to the person using the detector. It takes all of that complicated physics and math and turns it into something we can readily understand. Some detectors do it much better than others.

Statistically, if you find deep silver, it will most likely be a dime. Taking that into consideration the penny will return a stronger signal because the penny has a bigger surface area and thickness. The conductivity of both alloys are not too different. At depth, you will have a better chance of getting a good signal from the target that has the greatest surface area (unless on edge of course). You don't have too much trouble finding those 6 foot deep sewer pipes, do you? (granted, that is also in part because they contain iron)

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Old 01-10-2017, 01:35 PM
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Ok, I keep hearing a lot about high conductors and low conductors. I just looked up metal conductivity and it looks like the top four are (in order of best to worst): silver, copper, gold, aluminum. My question is why can't a gold ring be differentiated from an old beaver tail pull tab ring? I'm pretty new to this and trying to understand the physics of how this all works.

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Old 01-10-2017, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by NCtoad View post
Ok, I keep hearing a lot about high conductors and low conductors. I just looked up metal conductivity and it looks like the top four are (in order of best to worst): silver, copper, gold, aluminum. My question is why can't a gold ring be differentiated from an old beaver tail pull tab ring? I'm pretty new to this and trying to understand the physics of how this all works.
Gold used in jewelry is generally alloyed. Conductivity decreases a lot from 24k to 18k to 14k.

24k gold will run up high, since it is a really good conductor. 14k gold is only 59% gold and is often debases with things such as nickle, cadmium, lead, iron, zinc, tin, etc. All of these metals have poor conductivity and when added to the gold it greatly reduce the gold's conductivity. The same thing happens with silver and copper.

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Old 01-10-2017, 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted by BottleCapKing View post
Gold used in jewelry is generally alloyed. Conductivity decreases a lot from 24k to 18k to 14k.

24k gold will run up high, since it is a really good conductor. 14k gold is only 59% gold and is often debases with things such as nickle, cadmium, lead, iron, zinc, tin, etc. All of these metals have poor conductivity and when added to the gold it greatly reduce the gold's conductivity. The same thing happens with silver and copper.
Ok, that makes sense. Thanks! Too bad everything can't be 24k

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Old 01-10-2017, 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by BottleCapKing View post
All detectors working at the same operating frequency will respond to metal the same. How a metal response is based upon conductivity, surface area, thickness, orientation in the ground, temperature, and ... Frequency. It is the laws of physics. No detector can violate them.

What is different is how a detector will receive and process the target information. Receive coil sensitivity, ground balancing, digital signal processing, operating frequency/frequencies - these are what matters to the person using the detector. It takes all of that complicated physics and math and turns it into something we can readily understand. Some detectors do it much better than others.

Statistically, if you find deep silver, it will most likely be a dime. Taking that into consideration the penny will return a stronger signal because the penny has a bigger surface area and thickness. The conductivity of both alloys are not too different. At depth, you will have a better chance of getting a good signal from the target that has the greatest surface area (unless on edge of course). You don't have too much trouble finding those 6 foot deep sewer pipes, do you? (granted, that is also in part because they contain iron)
OK, not sure what you mean that all detectors shooting the same frequency respond the same. I would only agree if the processors were the same, but this isn't what I was talking about.

Second paragraph,, I'm good with.

As far as the last, you may have the point. Just would have thought the size of the penny to dime wouldn't have increased the intensity that greatly. So if I machined a penny to the exact size of a dime would you think they would give the same tone and VDI?

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