Big Boys Hobbies

Run off...***UPDATED***

jason_k

jason_k

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 19, 2012
Messages
429
Location
Central California
This morning, we were asked to leave by our parks department at 0630. I'm in the process of seeking a meeting with our parks maintenence supervisor... Here is the e-mail I sent, perhaps it can help someone else... I'm optimistic at this point, I think it is a misunderstanding.

Good Morning Mr. XXXX,

I am seeking clarification concerning the hobby of metal detecting in XXXXX parks. This morning, my friend XXXX XXXX and I were enjoying our hobby of metal detecting at XXXX Park. After an hour of detecting at 0630, we were asked to leave by XXXX, one of your maintenance employees. He handed us your business card and politely told us that his supervisor on duty wished us to leave. I think the impression was that we were in some way damaging the parks or causing a nuisance, but please let me assure you, this was not the case. We were able to show him the metal trash we had collected, as well as that after an hour of enjoying our hobby, the beauty and safety of the park was in no way diminished, and there was no evidence of our activity. He suggested that we contact you and attempt to explain our case as we did to him.

Based on our conversation with XXXX, I would like to request a meeting where I can explain our activity and the benefits that it yields for our parks, community and the hobby participants. During this meeting, I can provide examples of dangerous objects we have removed, as well as exciting examples of local historical artifacts that have been recovered and delivered to the XXXX Historical Society for display. I would also be happy to provide a demonstration of the extraction techniques that we use to ensure there is no evidence left of our activity.

You should also know that, last November, I had received permission to detect XXXX Parks from XXXX XXXX, a management analyst, after submitting an inquiry on the City of XXXX Webpage. We were enjoying our hobby based on this permission.

XXXX parks are beautiful and my wife and I enjoy using them with my two children, five and two. My last intention is in any way to compromise the beauty or safety of them. I believe that if you hear me out, you will agree that the hobby of metal detecting is a reasonable and beneficial activity for our city parks.

Thank you in advance for your time,

Jason KXXXX
XXX XXX XXXX
[email protected]
 
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Great letter. Hope all ends well for you guys. I had the same thing happen to me here in Louisiana. I contacted the local head of all the parks here in baton rouge and told them about my harassment. I simply told them to educate those foolish park rangers that can't even tell me park ordinance even thought I know them. I can't stand it when when my tax dollars pay for public parks that look like !!!!.
 
sleepyjim said:
Nice letter, should be used as a guide on contacting officials.....

Whole lot better than:

"Hey f!c^@%%#&*, I am sick of your bu!!s2132 and telling me what I can and cannot do...."

LOL
Click to expand...
Lol! That would have been Supercharged65's email! I had to work fast to email first! :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Thanks for the kind words guys. Will keep you posted.
 
That, in my opinion, is one of the best written letters of its type that I have seen. You should be commended for providing for all of us a perfect example of what we should be doing when faced with a similar situation. My hat's off to you sir!!
 
Reply from City

Okay, so here is the reply. Any ideas how to proceed? The ordinance appears to be 35 years old, one year older than me... Has anyone had luck resolving the concerns that were presented to me below? I know the intention is to prevent vandalzing or damaging the vegitation. I personally know 3 other local detectorists and have seen about 10 others over the years. There cant be too many of us in the city. Our city has about 100K people.

Thanks guys. Jason


Dear Mr. KXXX,

Thank You for your email and feedback regarding the XXXX Parks and your enjoyment of them. The Parks Maintenance section of the Public Works Department works very hard each day for the residents of XXXX and takes pride in the maintenance work that we perform.

I spoke with both XXXX and XXXX and want to provide clarification on the issue of Metal Detecting in our Parks. The use of a metal detector is not prohibited and is allowed. The City does however have an ordinance regarding the practice of digging holes in the lawn of a park to collect items buried below. I have attached the language from the ordinance here for your reference:
XX.XX.XXX Care of trees shrubbery, lawns.

It is unlawful for any person to damage, cut, carve, transplant or remove any tree, plant, wood, turf, or grass, or pick the flowers or seeds of any tree or plant, or attach any rope, wire, or other object to any tree or plant. (Ord. XXX §X, 1978).

The challenge for the City is that not all persons performing this activity take care in repairing the area excavated within the lawn and leave both an issue for City staff to repair and a potential tripping hazard for other park patrons. This can therefore become a City Liability.

If the City was to grant someone a request to dig holes in the park turf, all requests would have to be granted which simply is not feasible. It is important to be consistent and fair with all requests of this type. Also as a Supervisor I am unable to give someone permission for an activity that is against any City Ordinance, Land Use Code or Law.

Hopefully this provides clarification on the issue. Please continue to enjoy the Parks for your metal detecting hobby while complying with our City Ordinance.

Respectfully,
XXX XXX

XXX XXX
City of XXX
Public Works Supervisor-Parks
 
I read it as you have permission to metal detect and retrieve items buried in the grass but not deeper where you would have to dig. Maybe when you go out just bring screwdriver or "probe" to pop out anything near the top. don't carry any type of shovel/cutting tool on you so they can't say you were digging holes.
 
As has been suggested, try using a probe/screwdriver for now.
I see you are in Central California, is you feel comfortable with it, PM me the city you are in.
 
Well, we'll see. I'm not ready to throw in the towel just yet. We just need to figure out how to approach this...

For now I guess it is screwdrivers and tot-lots...
 
jason_k said:
Well, we'll see. I'm not ready to throw in the towel just yet. We just need to figure out how to approach this...

For now I guess it is screwdrivers and tot-lots...
Click to expand...

Have the same rules for city parks in my area, but they will atleast allow a screwdriver.
 
jason_k said:
screwdrivers and tot-lots...
Click to expand...

Thanks. I have been looking for a name for my band. That name ought to provoke interest. But yah, turn down the SENS and start probing! I did that very thing for a couple hours while 2 city park trucks sat and watched. They left before I did. Funny thing is, on a couple targets, I did more damage than with a shovel. But it looks harmless. Except maybe in a tot-lot.
 
Have him look up, Or YOU look up "Dane County Parks Metal Detecting Permit" for Dane County in Wisconsin. Its FREE. One has only to stop by the parks office, Read their information paper and sign it. It basically says everything thats listed in our "Code of ethics" here on the forums. All they would have to do is write up the "Rules" for digging/retrieving items and make up 3x5 cards that they can put your name on and have you sign it. Then you carry it with you. Very simple thing for them to do and VERY Low cost if any. Heck, If they wanted to they could ask you to pay $3-$5 for the permit. Ours is good for 3 years. Who would NOT be willing to pay 3-5 bucks for the LEGAL ability to retrieve goodies from the parks. You'd make that up in one visit. OR go before the parks commission and show them your trash and ask them about making a permit system.
 
legal aspect

Maybe I'm looking at this too deep, but if they allow soccer or baseball to be played in the parks then they are also breaking city ord.

It is unlawful for any person to damage, cut, carve, transplant or remove any tree, plant, wood, turf, or grass, or pick the flowers or seeds of any tree or plant, or attach any rope, wire, or other object to any tree or plant. (Ord. XXX §X, 1978).

How do they play soccer or baseball without damaging any grass or turf, maybe it's time to hit city hall and demand all playing on park grass stop immediately. I hate when they try to use a law and don't really look over what was written.
 
Omg

If they dont want you to walk on the grass then what a waste of space. I would write a letter to the city and tell them to use Imminent Domain and pave the parks over for the public safety and put some business in there to make money. And to fire all those city parks employees, they are a danger to the city as they dig holes too.
 
apaininmyglass said:
Maybe I'm looking at this too deep, but if they allow soccer or baseball to be played in the parks then they are also breaking city ord.

It is unlawful for any person to damage, cut, carve, transplant or remove any tree, plant, wood, turf, or grass, or pick the flowers or seeds of any tree or plant, or attach any rope, wire, or other object to any tree or plant. (Ord. XXX §X, 1978).

How do they play soccer or baseball without damaging any grass or turf, maybe it's time to hit city hall and demand all playing on park grass stop immediately. I hate when they try to use a law and don't really look over what was written.
Click to expand...

THAT would have been my rebuttal to his bullcrap from the start! no damaging the grass or turf means everyone..not just someone with a metal detector. '

i bet he would have tried saying "oh but they arent digging holes so i think its ok". i would be LIVID during and after talking to this guy.

wonder what the parks dept. would say if they were sued for discrimination against our hobbyists? it would be worth trying i think. i know if my town ever puts up signs against metal detecting, the city hall powers that be as well as the parks dept. super will be sick of seeing and hearing from me. :lol:
 
Sadly, CYA is very prevalent with city officials.

You should hunt like normal and when you're confronted with the city ordinance tell them you're not cutting/carving/damaging .... you're flapping! that's not in the city ordinance...

you could propose that he go out with you so you can show him how you cut a flap/plug and replace it properly. Then have the city council pass an ordinance that to receive an MD permit, they have to go through you're flap cutting school and register with the city!!
 
I would video the soccer players, football players and dog/Frisbee throwers and then the damage they have done. Video the license of the car they get into and present it to the parks department, send a copy to the police department along with a copy of the e mail from the park. Ask why the law is not enforced equally? Tell them "it is too bad you have to spend your time being a vigilante, tracking down evil doers, like soccer players, when you could be spending your time quietly removing dangerous trash from the park". Call a local newspaper columnist and explain your case. Hit the removal of trash part hard and ask why a positive force for park safety is being unfairly singled out and denied their right to responsibly use the park? Offer to help draft a policy/permit statement. A simple permit to keep track of all metal detectorists would help in weeding out the bad apples who don't restore the turf. Form or join a club in your area. More voices make a bigger noise.
 
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