F2 versus Vanquish

caheaton

Full Member
Joined
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SW OH East of Cincinnati
Hello. I'm intrigued by the new Vanquish series, particularly the multi frequency ability. One reservation I have is that I did one one review that knocked the Vanquish for it's inability to find coins that may be masked by trash. The F2 performs quite well in this regard (i.e., finding coins close to trash). I've been searching online, but have yet to find any evaluations that put these two head to head. A weak area of the F2 is small gold...it struggles on these items (e.g., a small gold earring or earring back). I'm assuming the Vanquish would perform better here due to the mutl-frequency.

So, I'm turning to the forums. Would it behoove me to upgrade my F2 to a Vanquish 440? Or would this simply be more of a lateral move?

Craig
ancient Whites 5000D, Fisher F2, Fisher F70
 
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If you want small gold i'd look for a detector built for it, as the f2 and vanquish most assuredly aren't haha. that said, the f2 is a really good unit! i loved, loved using mine.
 
caheaton: said:

Hello. I'm intrigued by the new Vanquish series, particularly the multi frequency ability.
Craig, I read a problem right away when I looked at your forum post. Why, what reason, are you 'intrigued' by the Vanquish series "Multi-Frequency?" Now, don't get me wrong because I like the Vanquish 540 enough that I bought two 540 Pro Packs. I keep one each of the coils mounted full-time that way to grab what I want for a particular site.

But I understand what the Vanquish can do for me, having owned a few BBS Sovereign's back in the latter '90s, six or seven of the FBS Explorer series models, have also owned and used "multi-frequency" models from Fisher and White's, and currently have a n as-new Multi-IQ Equinox 800 package I am going to sell. I have previously and do own some Multi-Frequency models, but I also own and use choice Single-Frequency detectors that have strengths in performance that out-perform most Multi-Frequency detectors as well as a lot of the Single-Frequency competition out there.

I read so many Forum posts with comments that a person has to have a multi-frequency detector for best performance, or needs a Multi-Frequency model to hunt Iron littered sites or sort through bottle caps or be able to find more higher-conductive or lower-conductive targets. I hear claims of spectacular performance simply because a detector is Multi-Frequency, when in reality, a lot of the claims are untrue. Just restatements of things people have heard, but are unproven.

If you're caught up in the Minelab Multi-Frequency bandwagon, here are some things to consider:

The 17 Frequency Sovereigns did not work on all 17 frequencies at the same time.

The 28 Frequency FBS models did not work on all 28 frequencies at the same time.

The Equinox 800 Multi-IQ has 5 kHz, 10 kHz, 15 kHz, 20 kHz and 40 kHz individual frequencies available for Single-Frequency operation. But answer this: What specific Frequency or Frequencies are actually working when in Multi-IQ?

And if you think that's tough, let's consider the Vanquish serise. They have a Multi-IQ that uses 3 Frequencies. What are those frequencies? And better still, how many, and which one(s) are the Vanquish series working at ?
ACTUALLY

caheaton: said:

One reservation I have is that I did one one review that knocked the Vanquish for it's inability to find coins that may be masked by trash. The F2 performs quite well in this regard (i.e., finding coins close to trash).
ALL makes and models will encounter challenges in different circumstances when it comes to unmasking good targets in amongst trash. I have the two V-540's, and if I wan a better opportunity to 'unmask' keepers, I am going to be using the smaller 5X8 DD coil. I am also going to select the better factory default program for the site to be hunted, and then enhance that program by accepting' ALL Disc. segments except the first 2. Those I reject.


caheaton: said:

I've been searching online, but have yet to find any evaluations that put these two head to head. A weak area of the F2 is small gold...it struggles on these items (e.g., a small gold earring or earring back). I'm assuming the Vanquish would perform better here due to the mutl-frequency.
The Fisher F2 is NOT a very good model for unmasking good non-ferrous targets in a lot of dense ferrous debris. Also, due to the operating frequency, it is going to work close to my loaner-unit Fisher F-44 when hunting for smaller-sizE, lower-conductive gold jewelry, and that's not a strong point for them..


caheaton: said:

So, I'm turning to the forums. Would it behoove me to upgrade my F2 to a Vanquish 440? Or would this simply be more of a lateral move?
It wouldn't be a lateral move, but my personal suggestion is to go to the V-540 Pro Pack to benefit from the two search coil selection, the really good wireless headphones, and the weather cover and Minelab NiMH rechargeable battery system.

That said, there could be other makes and models that could serve your needs better. What type of hunting do you prefer to do? What are the you looking for in the way of improved performance? Do you mainly Coin & Jewelry Hunt typical urban locations, or do you get away to more rural or remote locations to Relic Hunt? What size search coils do you usually use, and what are your primary targets-of-interest?

Monte
 
Thanks for the detailed reply. I'm thinking that the multi-frequency may (unless it's just hype) aid in more accurate target ID on deeper targets. As far as frequency, from my research the Vanquish series operates at 5, 10 & 15 khz.

As far as detecting, I'm primarily a coin shooter, though I would be happy to find some good jewelry as well while searching for coins. I primarily hunt public parks and schools. Most of my places are very trash laden.

I guess the main factor is curiosity....I've read anecdotal reports of "hunted out" parks coming alive again using the multi-frequency machines and i'm curious if it's true. Secondary reason (and an important one) would be if the machine offers more accurate target ID at deeper depths. I'm tempted to purchase a unit to compare with the F2, but was wondering if anyone else had already made the comparison...

(As far as coils, I do have a sniper coil for the F2 that I sometimes use, but contrary to others experiences I seem to have better luck with the 8" coil).
 
My F2 can definitely pick up tiny gold as you described, as long as the sniper coil is mounted.
Like this clasp on this tiny, thin gold chain which both the F2 and sniper coil and my Compadre easily saw as a solid target I would want to dig.
Once I switched over to the sniper coil on the F2 it rarely ever came off because my precious metal targets and coin count more than tripled after I did.

photostudio_1588929594343.jpg

My F70 can also find that shiny, tiny stuff with most coils but the smaller snipers make it even easier.

If you are going after a new unit because you want a change or want to experience the multi freak phenomena and their ability to deal with mineralization or combat masking easier like my Nox that's cool, I get that, that is why I own and love to switch around between a Nox, my Fishers and my Tesoros of which both my Compadre and Mojave can easily pick up those small golden targets, also.
If you want multi frequencies to help you find more coins maybe a bit easier I get that too...I deal with massive masking issues where I live and as I mentioned the Nox does that very well.
My F70 also does a great job in this area and and finds coins and targets deep in all kinds of site conditions, (once I learned it well), but the Nox just takes less effort to do it right out of the box.

However, if you want to spend this money to buy a new multi freak unit solely to find the tiniest of tiny gold like that gold clasp in my pic or pinbacks or any of the other real small stuff we might miss, well, good luck with that.

That real tiny stuff is rarer than rare even compared to tiny gold jewelry like the way more common really small and thin kids or woman's rings like this one.
10k, tiny, thin, weighs hardly anything and found with my Vaq in the sand at the beach at about 10" deep...easily found with the Vaq as a matter of fact, in disc.
This is actually the first piece of gold I ever found.

photostudio_1588931564007.jpg


If you think buying a Vanquish or Nox or any other multi frequency detector will magically fill your treasure pouch with a ton more of those extremely rare really tiny gold targets you think you are missing I think you will be sorely disappointed because I doubt any of this new multi-freq tech will find you much more of that rare tiny gold than what you have found till now...if any at all.
To find that kind of thing you have to be lucky enough to roll over it, have a tool that can indicate you did and most importantly of all you have to recognize it as something you actually want to dig, which, considering most of these really tiny gold targets usually come in really low like in iron, ain't easy for any of us no matter what skill set you possess.
Of course you will find a lot more gold, tiny or big, more silver, more coins or anything else out there if you dig absolutely every signal you come across, and I mean become a literal "Dig it All" hunter, you definitely will be successful but at what cost?
If I was forced to do this hobby this way, and only this way, I would sell all my equipment and quickly exit this hobby because that is not the way I would enjoy this hobby...at all.
I pick my detectors and and attempt to learn them to the best of my abilities for the exact opposite reason...to dig the least amount of trash while still finding the most and best treasure which seems to be working well for me, so far.

Monte stated this...
"The Fisher F2 is NOT a very good model for unmasking good non-ferrous targets in a lot of dense ferrous debris. Also, due to the operating frequency, it is going to work close to my loaner-unit Fisher F-44 when hunting for smaller-sizE, lower-conductive gold jewelry, and that's not a strong point for them."

On this he is correct, but your F70 can definitely perform these tasks much, much better than just well, as well as finding tiny precious metal micro jewelry pieces.
I think maybe you just don't have enough experience using that one to realize that as yet.

Buy the new tech to help you find more coins or more masked targets or deeper targets than the F2 can or to get a bit more stable and solid info on deep targets than your F70 or just to experience this different technology but expecting to purpose this new one to just target that really small gold and assuming it will actually find it, any of it, would be a fools errand.
Just my opinion, of course.
 
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Thanks for the detailed reply. I'm thinking that the multi-frequency may (unless it's just hype) aid in more accurate target ID on deeper targets. As far as frequency, from my research the Vanquish series operates at 5, 10 & 15 khz.

As far as detecting, I'm primarily a coin shooter, though I would be happy to find some good jewelry as well while searching for coins. I primarily hunt public parks and schools. Most of my places are very trash laden.

I guess the main factor is curiosity....I've read anecdotal reports of "hunted out" parks coming alive again using the multi-frequency machines and i'm curious if it's true. Secondary reason (and an important one) would be if the machine offers more accurate target ID at deeper depths. I'm tempted to purchase a unit to compare with the F2, but was wondering if anyone else had already made the comparison...

(As far as coils, I do have a sniper coil for the F2 that I sometimes use, but contrary to others experiences I seem to have better luck with the 8" coil).


It doesn't matter what detector you use, if you want to find gold or tiny gold you will dig trash. Multi frequency is advantageous at salt water beaches. My F75 finds thin gold with no problem. It will also stomp a mudhole in the Nox when comparing depth in a field. Multi frequency isn't the be all, end all of detecting.


I've read anecdotal reports of "hunted out" parks coming alive again using the multi-frequency machines and i'm curious if it's true.


There is a chance it's the detector. However, when people get a new detector and return to a previous hunting ground they will listen closer and dig more to learn the detector. This is as much a factor in finding things you missed before as the new detector itself.. Some detectors are better than others in specific areas. That is another reason hunted out areas can come alive again.
 
Good to see you again Craig! Great replies on your question here..!.

What I've learned from following this Forum's Dirt Gold Masters over the years...it seems to be more about the 'Indian than the bow'....a focused intent.

I do like the F series rigs for picking through a mess of tight targets...especially the Delta Pitch on the F70...:beers:
 
I would go to the Nox 600 or 800 and skip the 540. Park 2 on the nox series is designed to search small targets. You can pick up a used 600 for around 500 and i have actually seen some 800's lately for under 600. I had a 540 pro pack and it came no where near competing with my 800 so i sold it. I found a tiny ear ring back at 7 inches with my 800. Honestly i almost gave up on recovering it as there was other trash in the hole and i kept thinking that was what it hit on, but after re-scanning the hole i kept getting the good tone it was just deeper and after covering up the hole 3 times i finally found the darn thing. I never updated my 800 and i have one of the originals and i am pretty convinced after hunting with my friends that it performs better than their updated ones. Not sure but i think that might be why i was so disappointed in my 540 it probably has their latest mulit IQ.

Now keep in mind this is just my personal experiences and might not be the same for everyone. Another note,, you might not be able to buy a newer 800 or 600 that has not been updated. I just know that i will never update mine after i saw all the posts how others ID wrong etc... mine has been spot on from the beginning. Only thing is mine will not pick up coins on edge very well in park 1 but i hunt in park 2 mostly anyway.
 
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