New shells, bullets, and an interesting surprise

Great hunt!

SnailRacer99 said:

and as for the interesting surprise, I found a WRA Co. WCF .30 shell a while back, and a few days later right around the same spot I found the actual lead that I believe went with it. I believe they started making these in 1895, though I don't know when they switched the head stamp, but I do believe this to be one of the original head stamp designs so if that's the case then I now have a complete bullet/cartridge set from 1895-? either way I think it's pretty sweet.

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Unfortunately, that isn't an old original bullet for that round. The originals were a round nose steel bullet.


I'm not saying that that isn't the original bullet to your brass, just that it isn't as old as 1895.

lame Thanks for the info though! I love learning about this stuff. You wouldn't happen to know when they switched from the steel to lead would you?

Steel FMJ bullets were required by the military. Copper jacketed bullets of all sorts became available as soon as sporting and surplus rifles became available.



The fact that your headstamp says WCF .30, would probably date sometime in the 20's-40's. Before that it would have been .30Army, and after then it would have been .30-40Kraig.

I have no diffinative information on headstamps. I just collect bullets......and guns.....and.....

Sweet! Thanks for the info!

Wow, I just learned something New! Thanks!

.30 WCF should be a 30-30.

cga said:

.30 WCF should be a 30-30.

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True!
In fact, Turtlefoot and I had quite the PM fest about it earlier.

The case shape is almost identical to each other, and I guess the bullet found (and senility) messed me up. As I get old, I'm more easily confused. I actually do have .30-40 cases marked simply W.R.A .30 .........must have been where I got mixed up.

As I said, the cases are virtually identical in shape. The only difference is 10gr of case capacity. Without anything else to compare it to, it is an easy mistake. And if one wasn't paying attention, it would be possible to even chamber a .30-30 round in a .30-40.


The stamp still is an indication of roughly the same time period...maybe a bit earlier, and the bullet is deffinately NOT for that round. Pointed bullets and tube feed magazines don't mix well.

However, the box magazine on a Winchester '95, and the side load box on a Kraig don't mind pointed bullets at all (again, the bullet threw me).

.30-30 and .30-40 both came out about the same time (roughly 1894), and nicklel steel became available in 1896, which is when the "new" smokeless powder became viable. Ammo manufacturers had to (and still do) be careful to not load older cartridges to achieve higher pressures than the pre-nickel steel guns could handle. So in responce, gun manufacturers made small changes in case designs so as to make them not fit in older guns, thus allowing them to load hotter stuff. So soon after introduction, designations changed. The .32-40 (top)and .32Special (bottom) is a prime example.


The old .30WCF became .30-30 shortly after the turn of the century because it wasn't long before there were too many other .30cal centerfire cartridges on the market. Just as what was .30Army (or .30USG) became .30-40Kraig when the Army adopted the .30-06, and they then had a different .30cal centerfire round. They couldn't call 'em both .30Army. But not all ammo manufacturers changed their stamps at the same time, so some were changed while others stayed the same for overlapping periods.

From about 1850 to about 1920 was a time of great innovation and evolution in firearms, the likes of which we will never see again. And John Browning is one of my most revered heros.

Great information (and pics) Longhair!

I did some more researching on your headstamp and from what I can tell, the W.R.A. Co. was used into the 1930's when it was phased out gradually and the W.R.A. headstamp went into production in 1928 and was gradually phased in replacing the former. That makes your casing 1930's or before. Just for informational purposes, there are examples of the .30 WCF with the W.R.A. headstamp.

Doug

Interesting stuff! Thanks Longhair and TurtleFoot for the great info.