Friendly Metal Detecting Forums   Antiques Detectors
List all sponsors

Go Back   Friendly Metal Detecting Forums > Metal Detecting > Research and Getting Permission

Reply
  
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-19-2016, 08:28 PM
ericp501 ericp501 is offline
Full Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Dirty Jerz
Posts: 121
Default Property line questions, township land?

I live in a farm area that dates back to 1700s. There are 4 old farm houses in our neighborhood scattered around all the 10 year old houses. Right behind our development is an area with a man-made pond and a drainage ditch. The property lines don't have any houses on them and I'm almost sure its owned by the township due to the drainage ditch. There used to be an old mill back in the woods along the little stream. I used historic aerials to see that the edge of the woods was not touched during the development of the neighborhood. Would love to detect back there since its so close with so much history.. Think I'm good to go?
Reply With Quote


  #2  
Old 12-19-2016, 08:39 PM
Big Treble's Avatar
Big Treble Big Treble is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: SW WI
Posts: 2,611
Default

Originally Posted by ericp501 View post
I live in a farm area that dates back to 1700s. There are 4 old farm houses in our neighborhood scattered around all the 10 year old houses. Right behind our development is an area with a man-made pond and a drainage ditch. The property lines don't have any houses on them and I'm almost sure its owned by the township due to the drainage ditch. There used to be an old mill back in the woods along the little stream. I used historic aerials to see that the edge of the woods was not touched during the development of the neighborhood. Would love to detect back there since its so close with so much history.. Think I'm good to go?
Noooooo. Not unless your 100% sure who owns the property. If it is township property I personally would assume its publicly owned, like it in in many states, but finding out its private property after the fact would be a little irresponsible and potentially costly. Does the townships own drainage ditches in your state?

__________________
E-Trac, Spectra V3i, ATPro----Most days I'm not sure if I'm a Metal Detectorist, or a Scrap Metal Relocation Engineer.
Big Treble Outdoors Treasure Adventures -Missing big silver & anything remotely valuable since 2010.

Reply With Quote


  #3  
Old 12-19-2016, 08:45 PM
bruinvikes's Avatar
bruinvikes bruinvikes is online now
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Curtice, Ohio
Posts: 5,348
Default

I agree, play it safe and look into it. If you're like me, you don't need the trouble. Besides, it would show that you're a responsible metal detectorist too. Just my opinion.

__________________
Fisher F70, Fisher F2, 2017 clad: $10.37, Silver coins: 2, Wheaties: 9, Gold rings: 1, Silver rings: 0, Total clad: $248.28, (after paying off the F2), Silver coins: 23, Gold rings: 4

Reply With Quote


  #4  
Old 12-19-2016, 08:48 PM
ericp501 ericp501 is offline
Full Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Dirty Jerz
Posts: 121
Default

I actually just found NJparcels.com... This site is amazing! Sure enough that whole area is owned by our township. I also found another plot that is owned by the NJ Dept of Environmental Protection and is listed as Public. Its next to a home that looks like it would be the person's property but its clearly not.. Might wanna knock on his door first. This site has just changed the game
Reply With Quote


  #5  
Old 12-19-2016, 09:01 PM
Tom_in_CA's Avatar
Tom_in_CA Tom_in_CA is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,679
Default

Originally Posted by ericp501 View post
.... Think I'm good to go?
Question: You list various physical features describing it : Pond, drainage ditch, old mill used to be there, etc... As if you'd hiked around and looked at these features in person ? Or are you gathering all this info strictly from satellite views and other such research ?
Reply With Quote


  #6  
Old 12-19-2016, 09:44 PM
ericp501 ericp501 is offline
Full Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Dirty Jerz
Posts: 121
Default

Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA View post
Question: You list various physical features describing it : Pond, drainage ditch, old mill used to be there, etc... As if you'd hiked around and looked at these features in person ? Or are you gathering all this info strictly from satellite views and other such research ?
The pond and drainage ditch you can see from google maps or by driving by. The old mill was found on historic atlas maps and the area it was located has been untouched judging by all the years shown on historic aerials.. the wood lines are the same now as they were in the 40s. The land developers just went over the farm land, didn't bother taking down any of the woods.
Reply With Quote


  #7  
Old 12-19-2016, 09:45 PM
ericp501 ericp501 is offline
Full Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Dirty Jerz
Posts: 121
Default

I decided to write an email to the township. I read through the policy for use of public land and saw no mention of detecting. I probably should have just gone, but I'll be within eye site of plenty of homes should they look in the woods. It would be nice to have a printed out email from the township showing I have permission to detect there to shut anyone up or have the police leave me alone..

Ironically enough, there is a line item in the policy of land use stating no one should interfere with someone using the land legally. So if I'm detecting legally on the land and someone starts giving me a hard time technically I could call the police on them.
Reply With Quote


  #8  
Old 12-19-2016, 09:49 PM
Big Treble's Avatar
Big Treble Big Treble is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: SW WI
Posts: 2,611
Default

Originally Posted by ericp501 View post
I decided to write an email to the township. I read through the policy for use of public land and saw no mention of detecting. I probably should have just gone, but I'll be within eye site of plenty of homes should they look in the woods. It would be nice to have a printed out email from the township showing I have permission to detect there to shut anyone up or have the police leave me alone..

Ironically enough, there is a line item in the policy of land use stating no one should interfere with someone using the land legally. So if I'm detecting legally on the land and someone starts giving me a hard time technically I could call the police on them.
If it's public land, I would not ask. Just skim the online township ordinances, and if you see none you should be good on the public land.

__________________
E-Trac, Spectra V3i, ATPro----Most days I'm not sure if I'm a Metal Detectorist, or a Scrap Metal Relocation Engineer.
Big Treble Outdoors Treasure Adventures -Missing big silver & anything remotely valuable since 2010.

Reply With Quote


  #9  
Old 12-19-2016, 09:54 PM
ericp501 ericp501 is offline
Full Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Dirty Jerz
Posts: 121
Default

I just got a notification that my email failed, guess it was an old email address.

I'll probably just print out the screen shot of the property lines where it shows it being Township property and keep it on me. Maybe I'll print out the Use of Land policy as well so I can show I did my homework. I think with all of that I'll be comfortable adventuring out there.
Reply With Quote


  #10  
Old 12-19-2016, 10:14 PM
Reef Runner's Avatar
Reef Runner Reef Runner is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: John H Kerr Reservoir, NC
Posts: 1,203
Default

Originally Posted by ericp501 View post
I probably should have just gone
Yep, you are probably right, maybe you should have. I hope I'm wrong, for your sake, but I doubt you'll ever get that email, or not the one you want, anyway. It's just too easy for people, that don't have a clue, to simply say no, even though there is really no ordinance or law prohibiting MDing on those public lands, assuming that's what they are.

Every situation is different. Heck, I metal detect behind my house, on a golf course, where I live. Yes, it's a small, semi-private club, not to awfully busy, but most people know I live here, and all I've ever heard from anyone is (even from the club manager), found anything? Never once, has anyone asked me what I was doing. Yes, I'm somewhat discrete about things. I usually start out in my backyard, and just ease on out onto the course, as the situation permits. I don't go out there on the weekends, during tournaments, or any time that the course appears to be busy. When I do venture out, I stay off of the tee boxes, out of the fairways, and off of the greens. Living here, I kinda know when the slack times are, and I tend to venture out at these times. Again, every situation is different. I'm sure if a couple more detectorists decided to show up, it would all be over, but, so far so good.

Also, it's sometimes better to simply beg for forgiveness, than to ask permission and be denied. Now, before everyone starts jumping up and down and pointing fingers, I DO NOT, in any way, advocate this as being the proper approach to accessing spots to MD, but again I do emphasize, "every situation is different", and must be read differently. You are the one in the best position to make that call.

__________________
nick, from North Carolina (a.k.a. Reef Runner)

Fisher F75, Garrett AT Pro, Pro-Pointer, Whites TRX, Jolly Roger Phones, Lesche Digger, 31" Sampson, 31" Relic Hunter, RTG Scoop
Oldest Coin (1910 Barber Dime), Best Find (3-ringer), Strangest Find (Brass Urn Lid)
Clad Count (1933 coins)/($190.01)

Reply With Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
  #11  
Old 12-20-2016, 12:04 PM
Tom_in_CA's Avatar
Tom_in_CA Tom_in_CA is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,679
Default

Eric, I think you are way over-thinking this. I could understand if it was private land. And I could understand if we were talking public land that's an obvious historic sensitive monument. But for "random woods" .... I think you are over-thinking this. I always just go, unless there's a specific prohibition to the contrary.

As for the worry that nearby people/houses "might see you", again, I think you are over-thinking. If it is manicured turf we're talking about, then sure: metal detecting has ... uh .... connotations (that you might be about to leave a hole in turf). But for the random woods ? I think not. And on the contrary: I find most passerbys to actually be intrigued and curious (eg.: asking "what's the best thing you ever found?" and "how deep does it go?" etc....). So I don't know why there's this assumption that "everyone dislikes md'rs". I find it to be the opposite (at least given the mind-set type location you're describing).
Reply With Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
  #12  
Old 12-20-2016, 12:10 PM
Tom_in_CA's Avatar
Tom_in_CA Tom_in_CA is offline
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,679
Default

And as for your attempt to secure the green light from a pencil pusher at city or county hall: I can understand the "feeling of security" this brings. But on the other hand, you could get an arbitrary safe answer of "no". When in fact, probably no one would ever have given the matter a moment's thought. It's the old addage of "sometimes no one cares.... UNTIL you ask" type scenario.

But I'm envisioning "random woods" from your description. Where perhaps people walk their dogs, etc.... If this is some sort of buttoned up place, or private land, or sensitive monument, then sure .... ask away. Otherwise think of yourself as just-as-innocuous as that dog-walker
Reply With Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
  #13  
Old 12-20-2016, 03:16 PM
Mud-puppy's Avatar
Mud-puppy Mud-puppy is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: West Michigan area
Posts: 6,306
Default

Something like that, you just up and go...dont worry about it, aint nobody gonna see you or care...people just dont look out the window anymore, not like they used to...they are all on the computer nowadays, in fact, in a few years, there wont be any windows at all I reckon...so go on out there and give it a sweep...
Mud

__________________

Detecting is the study of Mankinds interaction with topography, the untrustworthiness of pockets, and metals desire to return to the Earth from whence it came.

Reply With Quote


2 members found this post helpful.
  #14  
Old 01-04-2017, 07:50 AM
Ace400 Ace400 is offline
Full Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Ambler, PA
Posts: 181
Default

I'm across the river and my county prohibits it. We have a ton of open space around here I'm not allowed to detect on. Pisses me off.
Reply With Quote


  #15  
Old 01-04-2017, 09:23 AM
yendor44420's Avatar
yendor44420 yendor44420 is offline
Full Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Youngstown, Ohio, USA
Posts: 160
Default

You might check to see if your county auditor has a website. There you can find property maps with the own's name, address, and sometimes their phone number. It's a great way to get permission to hunt properties.

__________________
White's Spectra V3i with DX-1
White's TreasurePro
Bounty Hunter Discovery 3300

Reply With Quote


  #16  
Old 01-04-2017, 10:13 AM
Mud-puppy's Avatar
Mud-puppy Mud-puppy is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: West Michigan area
Posts: 6,306
Default

Humans are funny about 'Property lines'...All throughout History Mankind has invaded and disregarded them. It seems in most circumstances the strongest hand prevails...A guy has to be there to enforce them too...I have people trespass on my river property all the time, why? Because its a very cool place for people to pull ashore and camp or have a picnic or something...My detector tells me people have gravitated towards this location for 100's of years...I found an indian head penny there once...Its THE perfect pullout...

I dont care and if I did, theres nothing I could do about it if I wasnt there to enforce...I am not condoning trespassing...just giving the realistic...The bummer about 'owning' property is paying taxes on something you really dont own in the first place...The good thing about property lines/no trespassing signs is it keeps out the weak of spirit, keeps them in their own little box if you will... and is fair game to the other rare and adventurous bipeds who just go and enjoy this Planet unseen... Anybody I catch camping or picnicing on my property is considered a Kindred Spirit of sorts...
Mud
Attached Images
  

__________________

Detecting is the study of Mankinds interaction with topography, the untrustworthiness of pockets, and metals desire to return to the Earth from whence it came.

Reply With Quote


  #17  
Old 01-04-2017, 10:23 AM
NectarDetector's Avatar
NectarDetector NectarDetector is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Detecting365
Posts: 7,353
Default

I'd put it this way:

Let he who has never detected an area without permission be the first to cast a stone.

(Don't worry OP, No stones will be flying your way)

__________________
.

Reply With Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
  #18  
Old 01-04-2017, 11:28 AM
Mud-puppy's Avatar
Mud-puppy Mud-puppy is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: West Michigan area
Posts: 6,306
Default

Originally Posted by NectarDetector View post
I'd put it this way:

Let he who has never detected an area without permission be the first to cast a stone.

(Don't worry OP, No stones will be flying your way)
Yeah! Who has never trespassed? Jumped a fence, cut across a yard? Broken a Law? But for some reason in this Sport, we are to be held as the Moral Repository and High Exemplators of vague and assuming Property boundary righteousness?

As I like to say, "Let him who is without sticks, cast the first stone"....

Thinking further on the subject during this Blizzard when I cant get out for a hunt...About the ONLY thing a Guy ever truly owns that cannot be taken away from them are the skills/memories acquired that they carry in their heads. Everything else is fair game and up to confiscation by stronger hands..Even Health is fleeting....

There you go, if a fellow is lucky he may be granted @40 good years of health to ply this Planet as he wishes to enjoy its wonderment and splendor.......So a person should make the most of it and walk a free man doing as he pleases as the final arbiter on this matter within their own conscience...Everybody else in the Past has done exactly this...like the old joke punchline, "You gonna talk, or you gonna fish?" As for me, as shameful as it may sound here, I'm gonna fussing fish!

Nobody ever sees me anyway, so I incur no harm or foul to the Detecting Sports Reputation...I've got years of practice being invisible walking as a free man though, so I'm damn good at it...the rest of you better ask permission and get written script or just stay home, in your little box..
Mud

__________________

Detecting is the study of Mankinds interaction with topography, the untrustworthiness of pockets, and metals desire to return to the Earth from whence it came.

Reply With Quote


2 members found this post helpful.
  #19  
Old 01-04-2017, 11:33 AM
NectarDetector's Avatar
NectarDetector NectarDetector is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Detecting365
Posts: 7,353
Default

+1

That would be a great signature line

"You gonna talk or are you gonna detect?"

__________________
.

Reply With Quote


  #20  
Old 01-04-2017, 11:40 AM
Mud-puppy's Avatar
Mud-puppy Mud-puppy is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: West Michigan area
Posts: 6,306
Default

Originally Posted by NectarDetector View post
+1

That would be a great signature line

"You gonna talk or are you gonna detect?"
You know what? Thats what it boils down to right? I've heard said, "95% of Success in Life is just showing up" Its certainly TRUE in this Sport! This is an Outdoor Pursuit Oriented Sport, and as such, like our ancestors, demands a heavy driver on producing results..A guy cant be concerned about the little things like asking 'permetso' all the time...Those rules DNA (do not apply) to free rangers like us, or fishermen, hunters,trappers and the like.......No Trespassing signs are intended for Salesmen or falconers or mushroom hunters or tree sappers or something..not us free rangers..
Mud

__________________

Detecting is the study of Mankinds interaction with topography, the untrustworthiness of pockets, and metals desire to return to the Earth from whence it came.

Reply With Quote


1 members found this post helpful.
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:42 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.