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E-trac - nails giving good numbers - scratchy sound?

Bonesquat

Bonesquat

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Joined
Mar 17, 2010
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Location
NE Pennsylvania
Ok so I've been digging a lot of nails and other iron junk that has good numbers and depth readouts but every time it sounds scratchy. Should I avoid ALL scratchy signals and only go for clean ones?

I've been reading all about the e-trac and have about 9 hours of time using it but the nails phase me. It seems like coins sound clearer and nails sound scratchy.
 
Old nails, the copper ones, can be very tough. Those with the square heads. I don't really ever see IRON nails giving me a good signal unless there IS something good there too.
 
So I should just avoid the scratchy sounding high tones and move on? I check the signal thoroughly but it just never seems right. When I dug a wheat from 4 or 5 inches a few days ago it sounded clear and I just knew it would be my first good target even though I'd never dug one before with the E-trac. :)
 
Probably just lack of experience and learning to trust the detector. With the higher end minelabs those broken tones, or however you want to describe them, are much lower % targets than on many other detectors. So if you don't know the detector I guess you will dig a lot of nails ... because you're applying what used to work for you, but doesn't now. The bonus is once you really know the detector you hardly dig any iron. I'm still amazed how good an explorer is when I really think about it - something I don't do much because it's just the right tool for the job, and that's how I see it. After so long it's very normal. (but still great).
 
Well the way you tell if it's iron or not is from the first number, your ferrous number. The high tones you're hearing is your conductive tones. I don't usually dig anything above a 13/14 on Ferrous unless I want to dig iron. All of your best signals (silver and clad coins) will be around 11/12 ferrous and 44-47 conductive. Gold is usually around 12-22 but so are pull tabs so you can't really avoid them. Zinc pennies usually come up at like 12-33 for me. So you can see all of your best digs are at that magic "12" ferrous number.
 
Well it stays around 12-15 and keeps a nice 43-44 conductive so I dig it. I dug a bouncy one like that before and came away with a wheat - but the nails sound scratchy. Just wanted to know if I should be digging signals that read like what I wrote above.

I see a lot of users with the e-trac digging up FE tones as high as the low 20s. Your info contradicts that.:?:

I'm so confused lol.
 
CONSITENCY OF SIGNAL is your top priority. You can get crappy sounds but play with the signal.

Yes your sound is what gives you an alert and stops you to investigate.

Then what happens, do you get a consistent signal?

Then do you get a signal on the 90?

Then just keep circling the target, what's happening with your signal and tone.

While this is going on what's my threshold doing? Do I get Threshold, Null, then hit OR Threshold, then HIT.

(Personally, if I get a signal on the 90 I'm diggin' it, even if I suspect a nail). If I've dug say 4 or 5 nails at a certain site then I've pretty much decided what my machine's telling me at that site.

It's rare that your gonna get a consistent hit on the 90 everytime with a nail.

Then lastly, what is my Co. number? Is it staying fairly consistent.

The more you run it the more you'll be able to do this in a matter of seconds.

NebTrac
 
For anyone who hunts in iron you're making a mistake looking at the screen at all. My most masked good targets don't even register on the meter, even though I know there's something non iron down there. If I went by the screen I would definitely leave a lot behind. For the record I should say that in some of those cases the targets were very small, but I dig them all because my hunting is probably best described as being a button hunter. If you can find all the buttons, you can find everything else!
 
Banemorth said:
Well the way you tell if it's iron or not is from the first number, your ferrous number. The high tones you're hearing is your conductive tones. I don't usually dig anything above a 13/14 on Ferrous unless I want to dig iron. All of your best signals (silver and clad coins) will be around 11/12 ferrous and 44-47 conductive. Gold is usually around 12-22 but so are pull tabs so you can't really avoid them. Zinc pennies usually come up at like 12-33 for me. So you can see all of your best digs are at that magic "12" ferrous number.
Click to expand...

This happens on clean signals. But I've dug signals clear to 27 Fe and had it produce coins (I've got that on FULL Dig video also). I've dug IH's with a Fe. of 01 also.

Consistency of signal is NUMBER ONE PRIORITY. Do I get a consistent signal? Then do I get a signal on the 90? Play around with it. Listen to the threshold, what's it doing as your circling the target.

Its true. There are places I won't dig a consistent 1 way hit with FE's reading in the 20's. There are places that I'll dig everyone. You just need to see what your detectors doing at that site.

By the way Bonesquat. Yes most of the time a nail will have a "scratchier" or I call it a "crackling" type sound. That is why you have your quickmask, to confirm it. By you digging those sounds (a lot at first) that is how you learn your machine. I know that's what I did.

NebTrac
 
NebTrac said:
This happens on clean signals. But I've dug signals clear to 27 Fe and had it produce coins (I've got that on FULL Dig video also). I've dug IH's with a Fe. of 01 also.

Consistency of signal is NUMBER ONE PRIORITY. Do I get a consistent signal? Then do I get a signal on the 90? Play around with it. Listen to the threshold, what's it doing as your circling the target.

Its true. There are places I won't dig a consistent 1 way hit with FE's reading in the 20's. There are places that I'll dig everyone. You just need to see what your detectors doing at that site.

NebTrac
Click to expand...

Indeed! As that was what was going on in that one video I posted. The FE numbers were high but I was getting a clear high conductive note. Hence the dig and the coins.
 
Thanks everyone for the replies. I appreciate it. Usually on the nails I cannot get a consistent reading. I'll hopefully get back out today and get some coins. :)
 
For me the key to identifying iron is in the pinpointing.

Iron will give a false signal from a pointed corner, or in the case of a nail, the pointed end. When you go to pinpoint the strongest signal comes from the biggest mass of the target which isn't the pointed end. What will happen is you get a good sounding/reading target but when you pinpoint it seems to move off to the side just a bit. This is a dead giveaway that it is probably iron.

Pinpoint and mark the spot with the heal of your foot. Now move to an 90º angle to the target and pinpoint again. If it doesn't pinpoint at the same spot it is probably iron.
 
Detector said:
For me the key to identifying iron is in the pinpointing.

Iron will give a false signal from a pointed corner, or in the case of a nail, the pointed end. When you go to pinpoint the strongest signal comes from the biggest mass of the target which isn't the pointed end. What will happen is you get a good sounding/reading target but when you pinpoint it seems to move off to the side just a bit. This is a dead giveaway that it is probably iron.

Pinpoint and mark the spot with the heal of your foot. Now move to an 90º angle to the target and pinpoint again. If it doesn't pinpoint at the same spot it is probably iron.
Click to expand...

Thanks detector. I'll also have to give that a try. I'm still trying to master the pinpointing of the E-trac. I'm usually an inch or so off.
 
I copied and pasted this for ya from a previous post. Hitting the quick mask button will tell you the story. You ain't gonna decipher a coin by a couple of nails just yet. In multitone co running the machine you can avoid them very very easy. I think you are running in TTF aren't cha?;)

The nail story..... I had a problem with nails for a while until I learned what to listen and check for. The key is to listen for. On a point of iron or steel for that matter, the Etrac will say dig me most of the time. The key is you will have a little grunt most all the time on the opposite move/swing of the coil one way or the other. To me that is the first telltale sign it's not what my mind initially said it might be from the sound. Always start circling the target, this is key slowly isolating the sound, if it nulls out you have gotten the detection field dead in line with the nail or piece of iron, not just hitting the point. It will null almost every time if it is a nail. Disclaimer on the last thought, if the nail or pointed piece of iron is stuck straight up facing the sky, you will more than likely dig it. Next check is switch over into quickmask all metal. Your true readings of what is in the ground will show themselves. If the FE jumps straight up keep swinging and leave the digger in the holster. When you pinpoint is the next check, if it pinpoints to the side of the visual spot on the ground you are getting the signal, leave the digger in the holster again. It isn't what you think it is. Really all of this is letting the machine do it's work for you instead of you doing it yourself, "digging holes" and the above described steps I go through only take just a few seconds once you trust the machine and let it teach you. Quite often just one of these steps will let you know keep on moving or dig. If it is good and solid all the way around the target sound wise it just might be a good target. What you will find out is the ETrac when it hits a coin it will sound "slightly totally different", for a lack of better words, from all the other other sounds the detector makes. You will find this out once you run one for a while. A discrimination monster is how I like to describe the machine. Key is to let the machine do it's job and learn from it.
__________________
 
Jack Flynn said:
I copied and pasted this for ya from a previous post. Hitting the quick mask button will tell you the story. You ain't gonna decipher a coin by a couple of nails just yet. In multitone co running the machine you can avoid them very very easy. I think you are running in TTF aren't cha?;)

The nail story..... I had a problem with nails for a while until I learned what to listen and check for. The key is to listen for. On a point of iron or steel for that matter, the Etrac will say dig me most of the time. The key is you will have a little grunt most all the time on the opposite move/swing of the coil one way or the other. To me that is the first telltale sign it's not what my mind initially said it might be from the sound. Always start circling the target, this is key slowly isolating the sound, if it nulls out you have gotten the detection field dead in line with the nail or piece of iron, not just hitting the point. It will null almost every time if it is a nail. Disclaimer on the last thought, if the nail or pointed piece of iron is stuck straight up facing the sky, you will more than likely dig it. Next check is switch over into quickmask all metal. Your true readings of what is in the ground will show themselves. If the FE jumps straight up keep swinging and leave the digger in the holster. When you pinpoint is the next check, if it pinpoints to the side of the visual spot on the ground you are getting the signal, leave the digger in the holster again. It isn't what you think it is. Really all of this is letting the machine do it's work for you instead of you doing it yourself, "digging holes" and the above described steps I go through only take just a few seconds once you trust the machine and let it teach you. Quite often just one of these steps will let you know keep on moving or dig. If it is good and solid all the way around the target sound wise it just might be a good target. What you will find out is the ETrac when it hits a coin it will sound "slightly totally different", for a lack of better words, from all the other other sounds the detector makes. You will find this out once you run one for a while. A discrimination monster is how I like to describe the machine. Key is to let the machine do it's job and learn from it.
__________________
Click to expand...

Thanks Jack. All good replies here. I'll use these tips in the field today after work.
 
Alot of good points in this thread, especially the ones on pinpointing. Just to add a couple things I've noticed --

Go glacially slow over the target if you think its an iron false. That often gives it away.

I dig FE numbers up to 26. They are sometimes silvers.

If it is a really deep, iffy signal, but seems to pinpoint well, I will go into quickmask. Sometimes 95% of the readings will be 35-50. I don't know if my machine is defective or what, but often this case is a silver or copper. Reminds me sort of when the DFX would put hard to ID targets in +95. I've never read anywhere where Minelab puts hard to ID targets at 35-50, but I've found some good ones there, so take it FWIW. Note these are really deep, iffy targets.

Sometimes you just have to dig them. And many times they are nails, but sometimes they are silvers. The one I'll remember was a merc at 8 inches on its side that I was certain was an iron false. But, usually you can tell.

Good luck.
 
Thanks Randy.

I was concerned about sweep speed. Last night I was going very slowly and just not finding much at all - even targets that good just sounded a lot better with a faster sweep speed. I noticed I was digging 10 times as many targets when I sped up my swing speed. I was pulling coins out constantly from 5-6 inches, some had bottlecaps on TOP of them. The slow swing speed only made my experience horrible.

Any input on swing speed?
 
2½ to 3 second one way sweep in non-trashy ground.

Closer to 4 in trashier ground.

If your experiencing a constant null, in a big area (like around the outskirts of old buildings) then I'll usually switch to TTF with fairly open screen and slow down.

Some guys use an extremely slow speed, I do not, but you do see finds being made both ways.

If you watched my "falsing video" I covered my normal sweep speed.

NebTrac
 
NebTrac said:
2½ to 3 second one way sweep in non-trashy ground.

Closer to 4 in trashier ground.

If your experiencing a constant null, in a big area (like around the outskirts of old buildings) then I'll usually switch to TTF with fairly open screen and slow down.

Some guys use an extremely slow speed, I do not, but you do see finds being made both ways.

If you watched my "falsing video" I covered my normal sweep speed.

NebTrac
Click to expand...

Your video are awesome nebtrac. I'll go back and watch them some more. :) Thanks!
 
bonesquat said:
Thanks Randy.

I was concerned about sweep speed. Last night I was going very slowly and just not finding much at all - even targets that good just sounded a lot better with a faster sweep speed. I noticed I was digging 10 times as many targets when I sped up my swing speed. I was pulling coins out constantly from 5-6 inches, some had bottlecaps on TOP of them. The slow swing speed only made my experience horrible.

Any input on swing speed?
Click to expand...


Like I said, you move slow, but the coil doesn't, it's short sweeps like pinpointing that is the best way to make targets repeat/work them out. I was learning this 9 years ago! :yes:
 
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